New Racers for Final Fantasy XIV

[Baxter]

Like I said in a few of my previous post, you're going to have to re-brand the race. This in sense can create mixed feelings for people who have experienced that race in another game in a completely different way and context. A similar feeling you get from "type-casted" actors appearing playing different roles that you are not accustomed to them playing.

What also makes people have mixed feelings is to stray so far from the 'feel' of the entire series, alienating, and polarizing your fanbase, and completely ignoring fan requests(Tanaka). Keywords here, 'fan requested'. Also If you are going to try to return the installation to a stead and true ff series feel, stop trying to be so variably different from everything, even your own brand. This goes for the subject of races, and beyond.

[lackofwords]

Also If you are going to try to return the installation to a stead and true ff series feel, stop trying to be so variably different from everything, even your own brand. This goes for the subject of races, and beyond.

What has been branding FF games, as I have mentioned before, are recurring creatures vehicles, characters, and names. Such as chocobos, moogles, slime, bombs, cactuar, airships, Cait Sith, Ifrit, and the name Cid. Granted these were not always in every single FF game, but more of a branding device for FF games rather than the races of Ivalice.

We've digressed far from my original, and only point. It was a weak argument to say something doesn't belong in xiv because it appeared in an offline ff, and not an online ff. To justify why they could just copy pasta a galka and rename it a roe, and not do the same for Viera is pretty silly.

Humanoid type of races (besides actual humans) aren't recurring themes throughout the FF series.

The reason races of FFXI were used was what I've quoted on Tanaka,
http://www.ffxivcore.com/topic/21505...aka-interview/

DO: Did you keep the races similar to FFXI’s races to help FFXI players get used to the new world?

Tanaka: (...) We made the game with FFXI players in mind, so we wanted them to be able to play with the characters they knew and loved. (...)

That's all, he wanted to draw the player base from FFXI into FFXIV. And it was a horrible decision in my opinion because it made players believe this would have been a sequel.

Additionally, it served no purpose in design to reuse these races in a new environment. The races for FFXI were crafted with the design of the nations, they were molded to fit the story and plot. Humes, elvaan, and tarus had a nation, mithras were mostly migrated over and formed communities within forest-like locations such as Windurst and Khazham, galka lost their homeland and reside with humes. They had culture and history relating in the development of their nation and beliefs. And when yanked out, and slapped into FFXIV they are nothing but another anonymous dude in game.

The races of Ivalice, however, only appears only in "Ivalice Universe" based FF games for a reason. They are all residing in the same world, they are part of the elements that creates the cultures and society of the world Ivalice. They exhibit the same behaviors and social standards. You also see the same characters such as Vaan, Balthier, and Fran making guest appearances in some of the FF spin off games. It flows in the same game timeline. It is all part of conscience design, and not just a mere gimmick to draw players in from another FF series. It is not branding for the entire FF series, it is to hold continuity for the Ivalice Universe.

[Baxter]

The reason races of FFXI were used was what I've quoted on Tanaka,
http://www.ffxivcore.com/topic/21505...aka-interview/

That's all, he wanted to draw the player base from FFXI into FFXIV. And it was a horrible decision in my opinion because it made players believe this would have been a sequel.

Additionally, it served no purpose in design to reuse these races in a new environment. The races for FFXI were crafted with the design of the nations, they were molded to fit the story and plot. Humes, elvaan, and tarus had a nation, mithras were mostly migrated over and formed communities within forest-like locations such as Windurst and Khazham, galka lost their homeland and reside with humes. They had culture and history relating in the development of their nation and beliefs. And when yanked out, and slapped into FFXIV they are nothing but another anonymous dude in game.

The races of Ivalice, however, only appears only in "Ivalice Universe" based FF games for a reason. They are all residing in the same world, they are part of the elements that creates the cultures and society of the world Ivalice. They exhibit the same behaviors and social standards. You also see the same characters such as Vaan, Balthier, and Fran making guest appearances in some of the FF spin off games. It flows in the same game timeline. It is all part of conscience design, and not just a mere gimmick to draw players in from another FF series. It is not branding for the entire FF series, it is to hold continuity for the Ivalice Universe.

I am not commenting on peoples' opinion on whether they want Ivalice or other Final Fantasy races in the game or not. We all have our opinions, and this would be redundant. I never said I was for or against this. I am merely stating that they had absolutely no issue breaking the continuity of one game's universe (XI) to add the races to another game that is, "in no way related" (XIV). So the precedent exists. My point is how can anyone say races from 'x' FFgame do not belong in XIV, when XIV races are ripped directly from a previous installment. Buck all the excuses, and reasonings as to why Tanaka did it. It remains; the precedent is there.

[lackofwords]

My point is how can anyone say races from 'x' FFgame do not belong in XIV, when XIV races are ripped directly from a previous installment. Buck all the excuses, and reasonings as to why Tanaka did it. It remains; the precedent is there.

Your opinion about how it does not break the continuity in other FF games is fine.
What I'm saying in my opinion, just because they can do it, does not mean it is a good idea. And gave reasons for my opinion as to why. As well as several other people replied for both sides.

There's plenty of opinions of both sides, but it is not a rebuttal if you keep reverting to your original opinion.

Here are some thought through opinions from both sides;

• [SIZE="5"]Does not break the continuity in other FF games;[/SIZE]
  
  

  I am about to blow your minds. XIV has rolanberries, a noxious invasive from rolanberry fields. A different world.
  Blown.
  

  My point is how can anyone say races from 'x' FFgame do not belong in XIV, when XIV races are ripped directly from a previous installment.
• [SIZE="5"]Has no design value to reuse these races in a new environment;[/SIZE]
  

  Using races from the Middle Eastern and African inspired Ivalice doesn't make much sense for the Northern Europe and North American inspired Eorzea.
  

  The races for FFXI were crafted with the design of the nations, they were molded to fit the story of the nation and plot. Humes, elvaan, and tarus were races built upon a nation, mithras were mostly migrated over and formed communities within forest-like locations such as Windurst and Khazham, galka lost their homeland and reside with humes. They had culture and history relating in the development of their nation and beliefs. And when yanked out, and slapped into FFXIV they are nothing but another anonymous dude in game.
• [SIZE="5"]FFXIV races are re-branded new races;[/SIZE]
  
  

  FFXIV races are not the same as FFXI. They are modeled to look very similar, yes, but they are not the same in any other means. They all have their own, unique lore.
• [SIZE="5"]Re-branding does not make people forget the previous brand;[/SIZE]
  
  

  Re-branding the race creates mixed feelings for people who have experienced that race in another game in a completely different way and context. A similar feeling you get from "type-casted" actors appearing playing different roles that you are not accustomed to them playing.
• [SIZE="5"]Final Fantasy Branding;[/SIZE]
  
  

  What also makes people have mixed feelings is to stray so far from the 'feel' of the entire series. If you are going to try to return the installation to a stead and true ff series feel, stop trying to be so variably different from everything, even your own brand. This goes for the subject of races, and beyond.
  

  We'll be getting more like this from other Final Fantasy titles to "Feel" like a Final Fantasy game. Just like Moogles and Magitech armor.
  

  They have all these great ideas from past iterations (not just xi their entire catalogue) to create a lush, fun, lorefilled, unique playing environment, but seem to refuse to do so. It leaves fans and on lookers alike stumped, baffled, and screaming 'wtf are you doing???'.
• [SIZE="5"]Ivaliace races not considered as the FF brand as a whole;[/SIZE]
  
  

  Ivalice is a sprawling world through multiple games and even a different game series (Final Fantasy Tactics/XII/TTAdvance/Vagrant Story), how would they explain races from a complete, different and unique world and timeline appearing in FFXIV? Bangaa are generally the "meh" race and merchants, so that would be fairly easy to fit in, but Eorzea isn't Ivalice nor is it anywhere near Ivalice. It's not like them having a Cid in every FF game.
  
  That's why they'd have no place showing up here, because they're all confined perfectly to their respective game's storyline.
  

  The only races that are reused in the main FF games are humans, elves, dwarfs, and the various trope monsters the series is known for.
  
  Being that 14 is a spiritual sequel to 11 and they decided to use races that would help attract the FF11 crowd, it's an understandable exception.
  It also cheapens the original games. Not so much cheapening XIV, but more so XII and the other Ivalice games, it makes them less unique, and that's Ivalice's best feature.
  

  What has been branding FF games, are recurring creatures vehicles, characters, and names. Such as chocobos, moogles, slime, bombs, cactuar, airships, Cait Sith, Ifrit, and the name Cid. Granted these were not always in every single FF game, but more of a branding device for FF games rather than the races of Ivalice.
  
  The races of Ivalice, appears only in "Ivalice Universe" based FF games for a reason. They are all residing in the same world, they are part of the elements that creates the cultures and society of the world Ivalice. It is not branding for the entire FF series, it is to hold continuity for the Ivalice Universe.

[Baxter]

Your opinion about how it does not break the continuity in other FF games is fine.

umm, no. You mentioned breaking continuity was reusing elements (races) from different final fantasy games in 14. I merely stated that SE had done it before. You disagree with that?



P.S. Oh yeah the rolanberry thing was a joke. Probably a lame one,(it's an inside one). It does further my point how they steal non-staple "FF" elements and reuse them in other FFs.

What has been branding FF games, are recurring creatures vehicles, characters, and names. Such as chocobos, moogles, slime, bombs, cactuar, airships, Cait Sith, Ifrit, and the name Cid. Granted these were not always in every single FF game, but more of a branding device for FF games rather than the races of Ivalice.

leggo.

[lackofwords]

umm, no. You mentioned breaking continuity was reusing elements (races) from different final fantasy games in 14. I merely stated that SE had done it before. You disagree with that?

Well, yes, you started as just merely stating that SE has already done it before. However, then followed up with that it is "okay" because SE has done it before. That is what I'm disagreeing with, your line of reasoning. I'm not disagreeing with the fact they have already used it.

The line of reasoning you gave which only opens up the topic was;
They have done it already, thus it is alright to do it again.
Or to just quote you;

My point is how can anyone say races from 'x' FFgame do not belong in XIV, when XIV races are ripped directly from a previous installment.

My line of reasoning is this;
They have done it already, but it does not mean it is wise to do it again.

Then, it opens up the debate as to why it is okay for them to continue to do so, or not to do so.

[Baxter]

umm, no. You mentioned breaking continuity was reusing elements (races) from different final fantasy games in 14. I merely stated that SE had done it before. You disagree with that?

Well, yes, you started as just merely stating that SE has already done it before. However, then followed up with that it is "okay" because SE has done it before. That is what I'm disagreeing with, your line of reasoning. I'm not disagreeing with the fact they have already used it.

And we are done here. Refuting facts for the sake of your argument doesn't make you right. lol.