Realization: Is the WoL a primal?!

[Dualgunner]

And this fact is the precise reason for his words.

See also Calofisteri:"...Why do you yet stand? I have supped on the Void! What ungodly power swims in your veins?"

Powerful beings can't really fathom a mortal beating them... or even surviving their attacks.

See also Diabolos: "Must I entreat the spectre of death to defeat you?!" (paraphrased)

[Ayer2015]

I was really hoping the 3.x series of patches would touch on this. Hopefully we find out more in SB and it just doesn't fall by the wayside.

[ErikMynhier]

The WoL can't be a primal, primals can't be sent on fetch missions. Can you imagine?

"Hey Odin, I need 7 iron ore."

[Enkidoh]

It's a theory that the lore forum has debated in the past but it doesn't hold any water I'm afraid - the big clue is the Sharalyans would have realized that immediately given their special aether-detecting gear would have picked up on us as being 'odd' if that was the case.

Also despite some similarities the Echo is actually completely different to Primal tempering - tempering strips a person of their free will and thus creates a feedback loop of devotion that empowers the Primal in turn and allows them to maintain a foothold in the corporeal realm. The Echo however, is the power to 'transcend the boundaries of the soul', usually manifesting in a Echo-user being able to view another person's memories as if they had experienced it themselves. It also can manifest as the ability to understand any language without having already learned it, and other, more esoteric abilities. It also prevents a person so 'awoken' to be tempered by a Primal - it is not the same thing though.

And the big kicker? Both Hydaelyn and the Ascians all refer to the player as a mortal, not a Primal. It's pretty clear on that alone the player's character is just a regular member of the six races, albeit one awoken to the Echo and was extraordinarily gifted in it.

As for

what Thordan said and how we appeared to him momentarily in that scene, Thordan's 'death' scene at the Singularity Reactor was just him being unable to reconcile his defeat - he had become a Primal himself after all and killed for good an Ascian, a 'servant of the darkness' after all! Defeating a 'servant of the light' should have also been cake! And yet he folded faster than Superman on laundry day, and just could not accept how this mere mortal could bring him down.

So he envisioned us as some kind of monster, some unknown entity that he could not understand or accept, regarding us a blank featureless entity. It was a visual metaphor for Thordan's bewilderment in his final moments, nothing more.

[Shougun]

I'm a primal? *Goes to nearest non-echo NPC and stares deeply into their soul*

"Give.. me... all the gils.. slowly.. into the bag.. yessss, very goooood"


Without lore change though we would be our own enemy, Shiva for example was something we tried to stop - even though they ended up being helpful it was still bad for Gaia, I mean Auir.

[FFX Spoiler]: I suppose we could be a FFX Tidus, the cost to bring us about already paid by the one that needs us most.

[Settiesama]

If we were a Primal, that would of made Iceheart a Primal too. Iceheart became her image of Shiva, so a Primal would of become a Primal.. :x

[BokoToloko]

I don't think so, since our power comes mostly from the Echo and we're empowered by the world itself (unlike Thordan, who just became an overpowered Primal).

Apart from a reduced number of in individuals, most Eoerzans are unaware of the Echo and almost nobody knows we're avatars of Hydaelyn. To the eyes of many, we are just absurdly powerful mortals. Thordan didn't know that we're the chosen of Hydaelyn and underestimated us, hence why he got astounded at his defeat.

And, though this might be sort of unrelated

I'd hands down like if we had to fight a primal that is a copy of us. Eorzean have such an unmovable faith in the WoL that I'd not discard the possibility of them being able to summon it if we get to dissapear for some time or something because some reason.

Gameplay wise, I know it'd be a pain to programm (because he doesn't have to just be us, but also use the skills of our class/job or, going further, having a skillset based in all the classes and jobs we leveled)

[Thunda_Cat_SMASH]

I'd hands down like if we had to fight a primal that is a copy of us. Eorzean have such an unmovable faith in the WoL that I'd not discard the possibility of them being able to summon it if we get to dissapear for some time or something because some reason.

Gameplay wise, I know it'd be a pain to programm (because he doesn't have to just be us, but also use the skills of our class/job or, going further, having a skillset based in all the classes and jobs we leveled)

OMG That would be an amazing trial! Though I imagine that would be better served as some sorta solo trial. HOWEVER it had better be spammable! Having repeatable solo instances would be tight!

[ZhaneX]

Personally the thing that turned me onto this theory the most is something that I don't see brought up very often.

When doing the Zodiac Weapon Quests back in 2.X, as we conduct research into the Zodiac Weapons and the Zodiac Braves that used them, a point is made that such Legendary Heroes have been noted as appearing throughout history during times of great strife, with the Warriors of Light evidently being the latest incarnation of such. The idea of cyclical appearances, almost as if in response to the prayers of those who grew up on tales of such heroes, just feels very Primal-like.

Compounded with the declarations of utter disbelief and/or outright horror from pretty well every confirmed Primal we've fought, and it certainly becomes intriguing at the very least. I really do hope to see the writers lead us down this path a bit more directly, even if just to dispell the idea in the end.

[Kosmos992k]

Personally the thing that turned me onto this theory the most is something that I don't see brought up very often.

When doing the Zodiac Weapon Quests back in 2.X, as we conduct research into the Zodiac Weapons and the Zodiac Braves that used them, a point is made that such Legendary Heroes have been noted as appearing throughout history during times of great strife, with the Warriors of Light evidently being the latest incarnation of such. The idea of cyclical appearances, almost as if in response to the prayers of those who grew up on tales of such heroes, just feels very Primal-like.

Except for the entity called Hydaelyn who chose us to be her champion, just as she has surely chosen other individuals in times gone by to be her champion in times of darkness to bring light back to the world. There is a cycle of Umbral and astral ages, but the appearance of the Warrior of Light or similar champion is not the cause, it's an effect caused by the coming of Darkness. Hydaelyn is in control of who is chosen, not some wacked out faceless wish from the people for a savior to come.