Community expectations

[GeminiXIV]

I see alot of these topics stating a certain playstyle is being "enforced" upon them but never actually see it, you know, "enforced".

All I ever really see is people wanting others to carry their own weight. Theres absolutely nothing wrong with that.

I dont use the forums much but I find this interesting.

[Lexia]

I dont use the forums much but I find this interesting.

Stick around on it long enough and will find plenty of threads of people arguing who play style is better.

[Reynhart]

All I ever really see is people wanting others to carry their own weight.

Problem is, this "weight" is for the beholder to decide. Some people would not accept anything below the optimal result, even if a sub-optimal could do well "enough". Jobs were rejected for that, "bad" itemization is frowned upon for that, and, most importantly, customization on characters and items is rejected for that.

If "carrying their own weight" was shared by everyone, then the game could be enhanced a lot. That was one of the purpose of Stone, Sky, Sea, regarding parsers. SSS does not give a number, it gives you a threshold. If you're above, you're able to do your part DPS wise. If you fail in content, it's because you're still learning the mechanics, not your rotation.

And besides, if you look at the recent "Soar Skip" debacle, it goes even deeper. Winning Zurvan EX without skipping Soar is not a DPS issue at all. Yet, many PF parties will kick you if you fail the skip.

[Ryel]

Problem is, this "weight" is for the beholder to decide. Some people would not accept anything below the optimal result, even if a sub-optimal could do well "enough". Jobs were rejected for that, "bad" itemization is frowned upon for that, and, most importantly, customization on characters and items is rejected for that.

"weight" Is not subjective unless a PF is specific and nobody gets removed for being "x" class in dungeons.

Meeting proper minimum ilvl for a dungeon or at the very least keeping up with gear appropriate for the level of content isn't really that hard of a concept. Same goes for hitting more than 3 buttons and not being an ice mage etc.

What some players still don't understand is that there is very little choice when it comes to gear options and it's by developer design. They intentionally have made stats a non-choice so if you're a DPS stacking VIT or a tank stacking DEX you're probably doing it wrong and yeah I'd be surprised if someone didn't say something at that point.

If "carrying their own weight" was shared by everyone, then the game could be enhanced a lot. That was one of the purpose of Stone, Sky, Sea, regarding parsers. SSS does not give a number, it gives you a threshold. If you're above, you're able to do your part DPS wise. If you fail in content, it's because you're still learning the mechanics, not your rotation.

While this is mostly true If we're talking about things like primals or raids the case is often players joining parties they aren't ready for.

If you are still learning a fight's mechanics don't join a farm party. Yet all too often we have players complaining that they've been kicked for x or y reason when the reality is as simple as they joined a group on content they weren't ready for.

And besides, if you look at the recent "Soar Skip" debacle, it goes even deeper. Winning Zurvan EX without skipping Soar is not a DPS issue at all. Yet, many PF parties will kick you if you fail the skip.

Then make one?

No, seriously. Full stop. Do not pass go, do not collect 200 dollars.

If players really have an issue with the skip soar debate (which honestly doesn't require a massive amount of DPS to begin with) then make a party. Boot up the PF and create a "Soar learning party" or "Skipping soar not required party" and I promise you it will fill. It may not fill as fast as the others but it will fill eventually.

The vast majority of "all these PF's require X" arguments could easily be solved by players starting their own PF but many of them simply do not want to, regardless of the fact that it requires far more time and effort to create a thread on the forums complaining about it than it does filling a PF description.

[Kosmos992k]

...

Edit : I'm removing this post because it's clear I completely mis-understood what the posters intent was. My apologies.

**mega snip**

[Miste]

Please stop trying to reverse the role of Duty Finder and Party Finder.

The person you quoted was talking about Zurvan EX.

Zurvan EX is not in the Duty Finder. You can only PF a full group or try Raid Finder (but no one usually uses the Raid Finder for it since most groups only go with one tank and the RF forces two)

So I think you might be misunderstanding.

[Kosmos992k]

The person you quoted was talking about Zurvan EX.

Zurvan EX is not in the Duty Finder. You can only PF a full group or try Raid Finder (but no one usually uses the Raid Finder for it since most groups only go with one tank and the RF forces two)

So I think you might be misunderstanding.

Possibly, I wasn't so much responding to the specific point of Zurvan EX as I was the sentiment behind the post, which seemed to be that Duty Finder is there for experienced players and Party Finder is there for others.

I wasn't talking so much about skipping Soar in Zurvan EX as I was about the philosophy of how to use Duty Finder vs Party Finder.

[Reynhart]

Meeting proper minimum ilvl for a dungeon or at the very least keeping up with gear appropriate for the level of content isn't really that hard of a concept. Same goes for hitting more than 3 buttons and not being an ice mage etc.

People keep using that example, but the truth is far more blurry. I'm not talking about doing half your full potential. It's more like "We should be at 75%, we're at 77%, you're out"

They intentionally have made stats a non-choice

They also have made secondary stats pitifully weak compared to main stats. As a tank you could stack all the parry you can, and your overall DPS would barely suffers. Yes, you can be kicked for not wanting to use Grade V materia on intermediate gear (True story)

If you are still learning a fight's mechanics don't join a farm party.

If we're in a learning party (Either by party or by raid finder specifically set to welcome first timers) don't throw the lack of DPS when 2 minutes into the fight when we're still learning.

Then make one?

Will it suddenly change the mentality of all parties that plays that way ? When did "not skipping Soar" became "not being able to carry one's weight through the content" ?

which seemed to be that Duty Finder is there for experienced players and Party Finder is there for others.

Since you can't set any requirement in the Duty Finder, you have to accept who the game throws at you. If you have higher expectations, Party Finder is there so that you can clearly express them and people will be fully aware of that.

[alimdia]

People keep using that example, but the truth is far more blurry. I'm not talking about doing half your full potential. It's more like "We should be at 75%, we're at 77%, you're out"

Hyperboles aren't gonna reinforce your stance, you know very well that attitude isn't as common as you make it out to be, nearly all DF complaints are because of DPS doing less damage than tanks (aka going afk mid fight very often) and healers acting like heal bots, very few people care about min maxing in DF.