Cleric Stance Discussion - Is it needed?

[Hyperia]

I'm ok with CS, what I want is it put in the GCD so I can't accidentally turn it back on when turning it off. So many dead tanks because of that...

[LaylaTsarra]

Personally I wish they'd remove the timer for it completely. I've lost a tank or two thinking I've turned it off and I hadn't.

[ManuelBravo]

So at PAX East this weekend, Yoshi-P talked about how he hates Cleric Stance, but he feels that people would be upset if they took it away. So I wonder... if they just made Healer Damage Calculations based off of the MND stat, would that be better?

That is actually what Cleric stance does swaps MND and INT, hence why healing is low when it's active.

[Alistaire]

That is actually what Cleric stance does swaps MND and INT, hence why healing is low when it's active.

He's saying they should make healer damage based off MND. It isn't, which is why you need to switch those stats to make healer dps effective. If they removed it (and they should, it only exists to punish healers when it's double-tapped) they'd have to switch healer damage to be based off their primary stat...ya know, like every other job in the game.

Cleric stance (and healers' damage not being mnd-based) is the pure definition of button bloat. Rework healer damage to be like other jobs and it's not needed, nor welcome.

[Zojha]

If they removed it they'd have to switch healer damage to be based off their primary stat...ya know, like every other job in the game.

At the same time, not everyone's heals are based off their primary stat either. We should probably streamline that as well then, if only to see healers outraged they're being replaced by a Summoner because Physick is sufficient for most content.

[ErryK]

Cleric Stance being removed and recalculating damage through MND would also affect healers in PvP, they would be able to deal damage again, as opposed to how now they're unable to due to Cleric Stance being unusable as is.

[ManuelBravo]

He's saying they should make healer damage based off MND. It isn't, which is why you need to switch those stats to make healer dps effective. If they removed it (and they should, it only exists to punish healers when it's double-tapped) they'd have to switch healer damage to be based off their primary stat...ya know, like every other job in the game.

I understand, however it's a way to make sure healers stick with healing as primary focus, while more adapt players use Cleric Stance to DPS when your suppose to. Kind of clashes with the whole offensive mind set of MND for healing and INT for damaging. Hence THU / BLM properties. It would be like having a blm use cleric stance to heal. If you think about it swapping numbers make sense with logical rules. Both Aero / Stone are elements so makes sense that their dmg is based of INT vs healing. Why would they remove it it balances the game healing jobs perfectly. Of course people would get upset, I for one would be. The game is easy enough as it is.

[seekified]

I don't think it's necessary per se, but Cleric Stance adds a sense of risk to DPSing. I think most people have misjudged a situation where they activated CS a split second before half the tank's HP suddenly disappeared.

That said, if getting rid of it would encourage more healers to actually use all of their spells, I'd say it's worth the tradeoff, even if I personally find stancedancing enjoyable.

[LuckiGoLucki]

I would be super on board with them just removing cleric stance and basing my damage of my mind stat all the time. I still don't think it would fix the current mindset about healers dpsing though. Instead of people shouting " I died and the healer was in cleric stance wtf!?" It would be "I died as I watched my healer cast stone 2/malefic 2/broil over and over again WTF?!" It all comes down to prioritization. Cleric Stance is not the true enemy here; it the healer that would rather nuke while others are sitting below 50% health. I'm not saying things aren't wrong with cleric stance (magically turns itself back on, waiting time) but more often than not it's the user not the product.

[Sylve]

would that be better?

Cleric Stance isn't the problem.
What would be better is if they gave healers more to do in party play (especially at higher higher ilvls compared to the content) that directly influence the success of the party beyond keeping the green bars full.

Boredom is what led to Healers contributing DPS in the first place.
Healers are the only role in the party that doesn't need to do something every 2 - 2.5 seconds. Find something to fill those gaps with that helps the party beyond simply being a DPS with a Cure spell.