Cleric Stance Discussion - Is it needed?

[Felis]

We need just more healer stress mechanics in contents, like more bees, or the boss cast a DoT on most party members following with a strong attack on a random member (Sastasha (hard) first boss)

[MomomiMomi]

Anyway, I say remove Cleric Stance and just scale damage off of MND. Cleric is a silly mechanic that just introduces human error such as hitting Cleric Stance twice, or thinking you took it off but it didn't register.

DPSing should, and will, stay as long as our healing is overpowered. But Cleric Stance should go.

[Masekase_Hurricane]

Until we have more than just heals then healers will do dps. We should have enhancements, enfeebling, debuffs and buffs to keep us busy outside of just healing. The closest we get to that is SCH and AST. Healers are missing spells like phlanx, shell, elemental spikes, blind, paralyze, Barspells, blink, haste, en-spells, boost stat spells etc.

Cleric is a stupid ability and should be removed I think it was lazy to not just let our spells be based on mind.

[SomeRandomHuman]

Cleric is a stupid ability and should be removed I think it was lazy to not just let our spells be based on mind.

As much as I agree on this for the unnecessary skillbloat, its probably some kind of oversight that they did and have to go back to the root of the programming to fix which they probably don't wanna do. On paper it should be an easy fix but I'm not a programmer so I can't speak liberally about the difficulty of it.

[Misutoraru]

remove cleric stand completely
give Lost City of Amdapor HM Kuribu ability, with lower CD (yes shxt happen like when i try to turn off CS, but itt didnt register becoz of lag/latency)
changing healing skill into dmg skill also reduce some inconvenience in switching hotbar with CS on and off, at least I separate Dmg and healing skill into two different hotbar
this will encourage more healer try to do dmg in dung, yet, i still hope CS/high dmg ability in dungeon/raid/trial is completely remove, and replace by buff skill

[Shiro--Tsubasa]

cleric stance should just be something unique to one healer or removed completely. (doesn't necessarily have to be white mage). Because this skill exist for all healing type jobs there is nothing for those who enjoy pure support gameplay. (the reason the whole should i dps as healer argument even exist is because people want a playstyle that no longer exist within the game) Essentially all healers are pigeonholed into being hybrid dps. They should have something like channeling or castable buffs that you can use during downtime that are short duration to increase your groups abilities whether it is to help tank with mitigation or to boost your party member's dps. Cleric stance is a bad skill that not only homogenizes the healer jobs, but its concept is lazy as well.

[Taika]

Because this skill exist for all healing type jobs there is nothing for those who enjoy pure support gameplay.

It's not because Cleric Stance as a skill exists, it's because there isn't enough healing or supporting to do for healers in any content of the game to make pure support / healing a valid play style.

I think you are misquoting the developers on what is actually meant by "left out of equations". Healer DPS is left out when calculating the minimum viable output, which means this is the calculation for the least amount of effort that a DPS should put out in in order to clear[...]

Basically, you can use the "healers aren't counted in equations" argument only if you intend to meet the standard of minimum viable output, and not exceed that.

Furthermore, the developer calculations aren't based on item level existing when this content is added to the game. So it's like saying people shouldn't do this content when it's released because that's not the developers intention (in other words, a really bad argument). It is literally impossible to beat this content without healer DPS when it's first released, and without healer DPS it will be impossible for great majority of players for a long time after that, since the DPS calculated for DDs by the developers' intention is that high (and reaching that as a DD is much more demanding than healing and DPSing the same content at mediocre level).

[Zojha]

[...] since the DPS calculated for DDs by the developers' intention is that high

I can only repeat: 85-90% of their theoretical, calculated potential with the respective assumed item level.

For tanks, they also literally only take autoattacks and the 1-2-3 (the basic combo to keep hate) into account. It's such a gross double standard between the roles, it's not even funny.

[Shiro--Tsubasa]

It's not because Cleric Stance as a skill exists, it's because there isn't enough healing or supporting to do for healers in any content of the game to make pure support / healing a valid play style.

There are other ways to support outside of healing and dealing damage. Like I mentioned in part of the comment that you didn't add to the quote. Buffs! These little things are amazing in that if given the chance, a healer/support could improve your party members potential. ie. something like what I mentioned previously, a channeled buff (a buff only applied while being channeled) on a target that can increase mitigation or damage dealt based on targets role it could be something like the brave/faith spells from other FF games. The reason support based filler skills don't exist is because the CS skill exist.