Cleric Stance Discussion - Is it needed?

[JunseiKei]

Look, stop calling this a meta. This doesn't happen because players decided to play the game a different way; the game is designed to give healers room to dps outside of raids, and even sometimes then.

Meta means any tactic, action or method which transcends the game's rules or conventions. The content is specifically set up to not require DPS from healers or anything other than simple enmity rotation from tanks. Expecting healers to DPS is an external factor that does, indeed, make it meta.

[Alistaire]

Meta means any tactic, action or method which transcends the game's rules or conventions.

And that's exactly why this shouldn't be called a meta. What are you gonna say next? Telling a melee they should aoe packs of 10 mobs instead of single-targetting a meta? lol

Things that do become meta are mostly in pvp type situations where certain things would be good, but become not good because everyone uses strategies to counter it. (And those counter-strategies also become referred to as meta)

[Kemonologist]

Why don't do something easy similar to AST sect? Making it can turn on only when outside combat but you can turn it off anytime. This will make healer only do full dps as opener when start of fight. This don't make any problem in open world content, healer can solo it like other dps who don't have healing.

[Clethoria]

As someone aiming for WHM, I use it all the time in PotD when healing is at lowest priority or PvE and I'd rather kill the mob over healing myself.

[Naunet]

I don't think many Healers who don't want to DPS realise how much worse their predicament would become if this change were to happen, because now they have absolutely no excuse for not contributing DPS, thus making the Healer DPS Meta pretty much guaranteed across the board.

Not if SE designed encounters that actually require healing... THAT's the core problem.

[Gemina]

I feel that Cleric Stance is along the lines of, "You made your bed, now lie in it." It's not the leading cause to the imbalance with our healing jobs currently, and the healer DPS debates is a community issue, not a gaming one that can be fixed by taking away Cleric Stance.

Did Yoshi by any chance say WHY he does not Cleric Stance? Definitely need more info there as he might see an issue with it that doesn't even pertain to the ones commonly discussed on the forums and reddit.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

I feel that Cleric Stance is along the lines of, "You made your bed, now lie in it." It's not the leading cause to the imbalance with our healing jobs currently, and the healer DPS debates is a community issue, not a gaming one that can be fixed by taking away Cleric Stance.

Did Yoshi by any chance say WHY he does not Cleric Stance? Definitely need more info there as he might see an issue with it that doesn't even pertain to the ones commonly discussed on the forums and reddit.

My interpretation is he disliked the DPS meta but acknowledged it would be difficult to suddenly force people to adapt. Frankly, I would say it's a game design flaw, if only because this meta wouldn't exist if it weren't for high healer potency and/or low damage output. I honestly cannot think of another MMO where so little healing is required.

Why don't do something easy similar to AST sect? Making it can turn on only when outside combat but you can turn it off anytime. This will make healer only do full dps as opener when start of fight. This don't make any problem in open world content, healer can solo it like other dps who don't have healing.

Because this would enforce "healer" and "DPS healer" roles. Scholars would be near universally locked into the latter whereas White Mage and Astros would suddenly be pressured into healing whole fights almost exclusively.

[JunseiKei]

And that's exactly why this shouldn't be called a meta. What are you gonna say next? Telling a melee they should aoe packs of 10 mobs instead of single-targetting a meta? lol

Things that do become meta are mostly in pvp type situations where certain things would be good, but become not good because everyone uses strategies to counter it. (And those counter-strategies also become referred to as meta)

Meta is much broader than "strat VS strat" in a competitive setting. We'll have to agree to disagree.

[MomomiMomi]

Meta is much broader than "strat VS strat" in a competitive setting. We'll have to agree to disagree.

Meta comes from knowledge the player has that comes from outside of the game itself. Healers DPSing isn't meta. "The majority of my opponents are using X strategy, therefore Y strategy is advantageous." This is meta.

Healers DPSing simply comes from the fact that healers have nothing else to do. This isn't meta.

[Felis]

We need just more healer stress mechanics in contents, like more bees, or the boss cast a DoT on most party members following with a strong attack on a random member (Sastasha (hard) first boss)