Should SE do something about PvE toxitiy?*point PvP change*

[Ama_Hamada]

Ok so the title may be hard what I mean but I am still, what you call "salty" on the PvP change while doing nothing to fight PvE toxicity. A few of my friends did dun before reset and this what happened:

So they entered dun, the 3 of them and all looked normal. The one on AST noted the other AST coming in with a potency burn buff. My friend who is getting into AST and learning it more and more thought it was very odd and maybe just bad luck. As the first fight went on she thought how it was very strange she was the only one doing the AOE buffs. This went on for every boss fight but it was hard for her to figure it out while having to heal so much. She had to heal a lot because people standing in avoidable damage for more DPS on the DPS meter. Our brd friend was dodging like she should but on the first boss she was tanking it though DPS, making there a lot to heal. The outsider AST was not helping much and never leeches (or w/e the AST version is to that) the doom off people and just healing here and there when it was convenient.

So after having moderate healing stress throughout the bosses, on the last boss she focused more on figuring out why. This top geared AST would baby and continuously buff their blm friend and keep them healed. Every once in a while you get Aoe heals but all the single healing went to this person and did not swiftcast raise, all in the name of having better DPS.

My concern with PvE toxicity is why everyone is so bent on DPS? I even had top geared healers myself bragging about their DPS leaving me to basically solo heal the party and putting people down. I have other stories as well, like wrongful gearing, putting crafter gear on the right side and being told deal with it because the DF is easy, having my friend MPKed by Alexander because she ended up pulling the boss by mistake because of all the feign pull attempts by the tank (vote abandon eventually since they would not heal her or stack with her leading to failed DPS checks) and constant speed run harassment in deep dungeon when my friend just wants to explore and get all the silvers.

[MisterLucie]

Taking a god awful change in PvP and also slapping it into PvE wouldn't solve any toxicity. It would just piss people off and prevent them from teaching new players fights.

All this "toxicity" nonsense is ridiculous. Some people are just dicks, slap them on your blacklist and move on. Don't get needed features gutted because of a bad group.

[Ama_Hamada]

Taking a god awful change in PvP and also slapping it into PvE wouldn't solve any toxicity. It would just piss people off and prevent them from teaching new players fights.

All this "toxicity" nonsense is ridiculous. Some people are just dicks, slap them on your blacklist and move on. Don't get needed features gutted because of a bad group.

so why was it done to PvP when PvE is worse?

Also I do not mean chat removal, I mean other preventive measures like premades harassing the randoms they are paired with, having weaker powers when it comes to vote kicking someone.

[BigRed5392]

i blame the raiding scene after the second alex raid. You only saw it a lil bit during 2.0 but since Alex S part 2, I've noticed raid dps mentality in non raid content.

My g/f had a mnk in "the vault" go out of his way to not attack the mob she would "unmend" he would single target it, barely doing aoes. She confirmed it by marketing a 1 on the black knight (the walking chess peices) then pulled it. He went to the white knight. She said "dude attack the one with 1" he flipped his shi verbally attacking her over anything.

Mocking her typing skills as she tried to tank, saying dumb stuff "your a drk in the vault lol", as well as trying to say some skills are shi calling her dumb, and claiming cuz she has lvl 30 she dumb.

My gf lvled up 17+ characters from 1.0-3.0, trying every class as every race before making a choice. She even fant. a few if she changed her mind.

What is worst as everything he said was nonsensical to her claims. Like ranged dps getting a free pass to be lazy, and that he took several jobs through the vault. She rebutted with "i was paying attention to my enmity bars and all but 1 mob had any enmity from you which was over 80%"

My g/f has been tanking since 2.0 and 4 tank based character leveling each tank more then once. She is not pro, but tries hard to constantly improve. Hell she tanked thordan on ps3 with issue.

tbh I'm not liking this "moar dps" mentality. And players making excuses for not working as a team, are just the worst. Game community is turning into dcuo... which ironically has a parser.

People like this mnk do the things they do, to artificially inflate their parse. When your the first to attack a mob/mob group and have the harder hitting attacks, it is pretty easy to top the parse. Which imo was what the mnk trying to do.

If you guys want fast dungeons, attack the mob the tank uses their pull on. And not spread your single target out across mobs. 4 ppl attacking 1 mob is faster then pulling 3 mob each person attacking 1.

Another mentality i dislike is the "skip it or quit/wipe" mentality. It is bleeding into trials that you can't skip mechanics. Like ramuh story mode, saw me g/f run this earlier and no one was doing any of the mechanics, people were getting terror-ed, no one was curing the terror-ed people. No one getting adds, and the mt pld was bad mouthing everyone because they died. Pretty much both healers got terror'ed causing pld to die.

my g/f was OT and did her best to tell ppl how to do stuff, and no one really listened.

when ramuh story was out, no one really had issues fallowing it, now you're lucky to kill the dam thing.

[MaluKalea]

Some people are just dicks, slap them on your blacklist and move on. Don't get needed features gutted because of a bad group.

IF they allowed you to blacklist people in early instances/dungeons like Ifrit I'd have done so already, but the friends list isn't accessible there nor are you able to blacklist players in your instance.

There's gotta be a better way to do this, the only issue I've run into is extremely toxic healers who intentionally pull the entire map to waste your time. I play any and all roles in MMOs and I feel awful for the tanks in this game already (Am working on getting Warrior, then Paladin) but in any case there should be a report option for people who queue in a party with a single friend and waste your time. I shouldn't be penalized for leaving a group that has no intention of finishing a dungeon and no one else should be penalized for premades that don't play for a team, it's ridiculous.

[Awful]

Also I do not mean chat removal, I mean other preventive measures like premades harassing the randoms they are paired with, having weaker powers when it comes to vote kicking someone.

Depends are you talking bout Shatter or Feast? Feast obviously there's no chat unless the person makes a toon and verbally messages them on their server or whatever. I've only seen one person vote kicked once for toxicity, I run with my FC mates and if there's someone in our group not gettin it together we use <se.X> effect to get their attention and tell em to stay with us.

I know SE is looking into doing something about premades in the future so they can't que as one which has it's negatives and positives, one being that it restricts more group play but keeps the people who are solo playing in check. You however forget that back before Freelancer was an option there were nothing but premades and PvP was pretty dead, if you were on the wrong GC you would do nothing but lose to these premades because it was enjoyable.

The point i'm trying to make is that i've never seen a full premade kick someone for feeding or ignoring ice, the only time I saw someone get kicked was because he was not contributing at all and spamming chat with "this is a PvE game I just want my mounts" and sat in the SW corner for 7 minutes until he got kicked.

[Ama_Hamada]

Depends are you talking bout Shatter or Feast? Feast obviously there's no chat unless the person makes a toon and verbally messages them on their server or whatever. For Shatter I haven't ran into anyone vote kicking someone because of toxicity, I run with my FC mates and if there's someone in our group not gettin it together we use <se.X> effect to get their attention and tell em to stay with us.
I know SE is looking into doing something about premades in the future so they can't que as one which has it's negatives and positives, one being that it restricts more group play but keeps the people who are solo playing in check. You however forget that back before Freelancer was an option there were nothing but premades and PvP was pretty dead, if you were on the wrong GC you would do nothing but lose to these premades because it was enjoyable.

The point i'm trying to make is that i've never seen a full premade kick someone for feeding or ignoring ice, the only time I saw someone get kicked was because he was not contributing at all and spamming chat with "this is a PvE game I just want my mounts" and sat in the SW corner for 7 minutes until he got kicked.

The quoted is talking about premades in PvE, not PvP. They are toxic, harass random people and even vote kick people for no reason.

[Awful]

The quoted is talking about premades in PvE, not PvP. They are toxic, harass random people and even vote kick people for no reason.

Alright I misinterpreted, and that's to be expected people have their own verbal voice in this game, people play differently, people have free will and will say/ do anything. It's no different from any other MMO where people will kick anyone just because they don't like you or because there's no tone on the internet they misinterpret the information.

Hell, even if you tell someone they could have done something better it turns into a fight look at the "Mentor kicked me" thread and that in itself is another beast as it's toxicity in PvE. I've been kicked for dodging a protect in a lvl 24 dungeon, i've been kicked to tell people that turning off Cleric Stance helps you heal more but weaving it is better, you can't honestly win.

[Ama_Hamada]

Alright I misinterpreted, and that's to be expected people have their own verbal voice in this game, people play differently, people have free will and will say/ do anything. It's no different from any other MMO where people will kick anyone just because they don't like you or because there's no tone on the internet they misinterpret the information.Hell, even if you tell someone they could have done something better it turns into a fight look at the "Mentor kicked me" thread and that in itself is another beast as it's toxicity in PvE. I've been kicked for dodging a protect in a lvl 24 dungeon, i've been kicked to tell people that turning off Cleric Stance helps you heal more but weaving it is better, you can't honestly win.

In another dun, my friend wanted more help from this max geared healer, making little comments like you know you need to take cleric off to heal right ? (this was after talking about needing more help and like them to cleric less.) Right when the battle ended this simply left, not a word said.

[Kaethra]

The 'fix' as in the one that would solve the problem of toxic players, is not a great one. Or.. maybe it is?

That fix being to require a full party (4 or 8 depending on content) before you can queue for a dungeon. This would eliminate the toxicity by a very large margin. And the reason I say this, is I've played MMOs that were like this, EQ, EQ2, and WoW (pre-LK). You didn't see players join a group and sit in a corner waiting to be vote kicked. You didn't see players harass others in groups for no reason. You didn't see any of that mess.

Reason for this is without an anonymous match maker you suddenly lose a great deal of anonymity. You end up having to group with people on your realm, your level range, and level of ability, or better said a smaller pool of players. Which means if you treat someone badly, word will eventually get around and you will lose the ability to swifty get groups.

The downside is obvious. You can't press U and join a roulette and it finds a group for you. You'll have to use party finder, linkshells, free company, and other means of networking to get into dungeon runs. But as it will be like that for everyone, finding a group isn't quite as daunting as it sounds. It still is a bit more effort though.

So the question is. Are you willing to give up matchmaking for this? Is the situation bad enough to warrant it? If the answer is no for either one of those questions. Then there's nothing more to be done. Its a simple fact we have to deal with. Just be glad this is a P2P game and not F2P. Those are far far worse with their toxic behaviors.