[SUGGESTION] Modify the function of "Need" option for loot

[Zigabar]

Are there any counterpoints other than "I don't like change", "Don't take away my seals" and "Don't be so entitled"?

How about "fine as is" or "working as intended" or "use POTD and never want for leveling gear again"

[Settiesama]

Are there any counterpoints other than "I don't like change", "Don't take away my seals" and "Don't be so entitled"?
Remember: It's not just you who is no longer rolling need on anything. The vast majority of people you'll run into will also not be needing on anything. Let's look at the numbers again:

"Greed only": 1/4 chance to get stuff in dungeons.
"Need only": 1/7 chance to be able to need on armour + 3/7 chance that nobody will be able to need on armour, in which case 1/4 chance to get it through greed. Total: 1/7 + 3/7 * 1/4 = 1/4 Little to no change in loot gotten from dungeons.

I need cloth gear. Smn gear drops, no other Smn or Blm. 100% chance to get it with need, 25% chance to get with greed. Yeah, I'll take my 100%. If I wanted leather, I would go Nin or Mnk, see the point?

Sorry, but this system is fair as it is. Want the gear, play the job, simple solution. The biggest counterpoint, is that the system ain't broken, we shouldn't be fixing what ain't broke. YOU need to try to validate your points for a change, but all you are doing is repeating what has already been discussed pages back, and has already been shot down by logic.

[Vidu]

Are there any counterpoints other than "I don't like change", "Don't take away my seals" and "Don't be so entitled"?
Remember: It's not just you who is no longer rolling need on anything. The vast majority of people you'll run into will also not be needing on anything. Let's look at the numbers again:

I'm a bit surprised right now that all those "Remove need"-people didnt simply propose a token-system... like we had for several ARR-dungeons (snowcloak, Qarn etc. - tokens that could be exchanged for the ilvl90-job-gear) - so everyone could roll need on everything adn just get what they want in the end... but I guess that would be to easy...

Other than that, just as Settiesama said: I'll take my 100% on some drops and accept that others have a 100% aswell over 25% on all drops...

[SendohJin]

Are there any counterpoints other than "I don't like change", "Don't take away my seals" and "Don't be so entitled"?

none of those points matter. the only thing that does matter is you choose to play a job for that instance you get the benefits of playing that job for that instance. you reward effort.

[Mholito]

I need cloth gear. Smn gear drops, no other Smn or Blm. 100% chance to get it with need, 25% chance to get with greed. Yeah, I'll take my 100%. If I wanted leather, I would go Nin or Mnk, see the point?

Sorry, but this system is fair as it is. Want the gear, play the job, simple solution. The biggest counterpoint, is that the system ain't broken, we shouldn't be fixing what ain't broke. YOU need to try to validate your points for a change, but all you are doing is repeating what has already been discussed pages back, and has already been shot down by logic.

It seems we will not be able to find an agreement in this matter. I am in support of this system because it would reserve the need button only for those that want that particular item, as opposed to those that only want it for its numeric value. The only other change it would have, is that whether or not you get a drop is determined when people are rolling, rather than when the drop is determined. I see this as the ideal use of the need/greed system. It is clear that most people do not share this view though, so I'll leave it here.

[Settiesama]

It seems we will not be able to find an agreement in this matter. I am in support of this system because it would reserve the need button only for those that want that particular item, as opposed to those that only want it for its numeric value. The only other change it would have, is that whether or not you get a drop is determined when people are rolling, rather than when the drop is determined. I see this as the ideal use of the need/greed system. It is clear that most people do not share this view though, so I'll leave it here.

What exactly is the problem with asking if you want a certain piece? Play the job, get the loot for that job. Not on the job, ask if you may have it. Why is this so hard? That 'numeric value' is more important to alot of people than the piece itself as it helps them to get something even more important to them. For ilvl, it will be replaced VERY quickly. For glamour? Choose the job or ask.

[ReplicaX]

Are there any counterpoints other than "I don't like change", "Don't take away my seals" and "Don't be so entitled"?

Perhaps read the actual thread where plenty of suggestions were made. Suggestions that enhance fairness of the current system. Instead of enhancing laziness and entitlement of a secondary perk.

If players actually ran content on the job they wanted gear for instead of a chance at Greed lotting it on others. Duty finder in all level ranges would have more diversity. With DPS Role being the highest % of players, Alt leveling and gearing other Roles with DF is an overall community gain. As you are learning and gaining XP on said job/role in group content, which benefits everyone.

Players relying on Greed Perking for Alt jobs or want the system changed to benefit them devalues player skill within the community IMO. Which is a highly discussed and controversial topic on these forums.

[BokoToloko]

The progression in FFXIV is swift and there's always a chance to get the gear so not looting a gear that is an upgrade is not as problematic as in WoW, where there are weekly and daily locks on loot per run meaning that people could lose a week of progression because other just wanted some gold that could be farmed in less than 1 hour (which, curiously enough, is why the Need Before Greed looting system -the one DF uses- was born).

A system like that could be made? Yeah. But it's not really that urgent (though, since I started in WoW, seeing people Needing on stuff for anything but glamour or gearing up, will always kill me a bit inside)

On the other side, and regarding all these complaints about the OP: How is avoiding overgeared people Need on items punishing? If it works for 4 or 8 players in the party, that systems would have you stand an actual chance to obtain gear to desynthetize/GC/whatever for gear that someone else in your party would need otherwise even if overgeared. Literally, you take out the barrier of the Need button when you farm though dungeons. If one run only gives NIN gear, the whole party won't be outright denied their chance to get loot by the only NIN that's there. And since there're more chances that loot that isn't for your Job to appear, it just would be an improvement on a personal side.

[Mholito]

What exactly is the problem with asking if you want a certain piece? Play the job, get the loot for that job. Not on the job, ask if you may have it. Why is this so hard? That 'numeric value' is more important to alot of people than the piece itself as it helps them to get something even more important to them. For ilvl, it will be replaced VERY quickly. For glamour? Choose the job or ask.

The need button should still only be available for the appropriate class/job. You want a particular drop for glamour? Run with a job that can equip it, and you're guaranteed to get it if it drops, unles there is someone else in the party that is also there for that particular item. Want gear for two jobs at the same time? Run as one of them, and you're practically guaranteed to get all gear for the job you run, and have a 1/4 chance to get gear for the other if it drops. Want seals? Greed on everything, and you'll get about a fourth of the loot that drops.

[Kosmos992k]

The need button should still only be available for the appropriate class/job. You want a particular drop for glamour? Run with a job that can equip it, and you're guaranteed to get it if it drops, unles there is someone else in the party that is also there for that particular item. Want gear for two jobs at the same time? Run as one of them, and you're practically guaranteed to get all gear for the job you run, and have a 1/4 chance to get gear for the other if it drops. Want seals? Greed on everything, and you'll get about a fourth of the loot that drops.

So, basically roll need for the role you play and greed on everything else? Is that not what we have right now?