Should the Heavensward Leveling dungeons and trials have item level requirements?

[Nixxe]

To take the aproach from this point of view "Would it be okay to go into Dusk Vigil with Gear from AV?" cause it's just a leveling dungeon and not so far into the level 50 endgame. This was spiced with some irony ofc.
The problem with this is, that Dusk Vigil is level 51 and not more 50 and it's mobs are thougher than the ones in keeper of the lake (min average ilvl 90), so i don't see any harm to set a min ilvl for this dungeons, especially this Dungeon is beyond level 50 and it's dungeon endgame, so the requirements should be beyond level 50 dungeon endgame too.

It seems rather doubtful they're getting in there with a full set of gear from Aurum Vale. It's not something I've encountered and it seems rather unlikely it's any sort of pervasive problem, if it's a problem at all, that requires a systemic solution to address it. If you get someone who is so woefully undergeared that they simply can't do their job, kick them (though be polite about it) and move on with your day. The need for an ilvl at endgame is because further character power growth comes entirely from ilvl, as opposed to actual level. The minimum requirement for leveling dungeons comes in the form of level instead.

EVERY DF in the game needs requirements, just because it is "rare" does not mean I enjoy carrying and stress healing undergreaed people.



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It is needed, every DF needs it.
Also every DF needs a WEAPON level requirement, and a stat level requirement (as in you need so much hp, so much main stat, to pass.)

average item level gates are too easy to exploit.

I don't think the game should have to be designed cater to idiosyncratic requirements for your mental well-being. As was covered last time, from a quantitative perspective what you called "stressful" should have been a walk in the park, even if it required the healer to actual heal.

[Ama_Hamada]

I don't think the game should have to be designed cater to idiosyncratic requirements for your mental well-being. As was covered last time, from a quantitative perspective what you called "stressful" should have been a walk in the park, even if it required the healer to actual heal.

the game should not cater to the lazy and allowing a system that makes 3 people to do all the work for them. You are insulting me why now?

[Nixxe]

the game should not cater to the lazy and allowing a system that makes 3 people to do all the work for them. You are insulting me why now?

I'm not insulting you at all. I'm pointing out that you, or your friend as the case may be, seem to have a rather low threshold for stress in this game, as evidenced by your own explanation of the situation. I simply don't think game design needs (or even can) accommodate the totality of each individual's individuality. There is already a minimum level requirement, the simple fact that most players are interested in their group succeeding, and if worst comes to worst a kick function. We don't need further requirements. We already have the tools and environment we need to solve the situation already.

[Miste]

It's not something I've encountered and it seems rather unlikely it's any sort of pervasive problem, if it's a problem at all, that requires a systemic solution to address it. If you get someone who is so woefully undergeared that they simply can't do their job, kick them (though be polite about it) and move on with your day.

Just because you haven't encountered it doesn't mean it is rare. Like if you had never seen a cricket...does that mean they don't exist or must be very rare? I don't know about you but I hear them all over the place in the summer at night even if I don't see them with my eyes.

People have shared problems with people queuing with improper gear so it exists. The main issue isn't about how often it happens just the fact that it would be simple to stop it from being possible at all and avoid annoyance and wasted time.

You can vote kick people, sure, but in the end they still wasted their time and everyone elses because now you have to sit there waiting for member in progress which sometimes a long time passes and you don't get a replacement and then sometimes whole group just ends up leaving and having to requeue...so...move on with your day? Maybe or maybe you end up wasting 20-40 minutes.

Why put up with that wasted time when it could all be solved by just adjusting the DF system a bit. A lot of DF content already has item level requirements on it so obviously it wouldn't be difficult to do the same for the content that is currently missing item level reqs.

[Nixxe]

Just because you haven't encountered it doesn't mean it is rare. Like if you had never seen a cricket...does that mean they don't exist or must be very rare? I don't know about you but I hear them all over the place in the summer at night even if I don't see them with my eyes.

People have shared problems with people queuing with improper gear so it exists. The main issue isn't about how often it happens just the fact that it would be simple to stop it from being possible at all and avoid annoyance and wasted time..

You can vote kick people, sure, but in the end they still wasted their time and everyone elses because now you have to sit there waiting for member in progress which sometimes a long time passes and you don't get a replacement and then sometimes whole group just ends up leaving and having to requeue...so...move on with your day? Maybe or maybe you end up wasting 20-40 minutes.

Why put up with that wasted time when it could all be solved by just adjusting the DF system a bit. A lot of DF content already has item level requirements on it so obviously it wouldn't be difficult to do the same for the content that is currently missing item level reqs.

This is a pretty poor analogy that also fails to capture my argument and my reasoning. For our purposes, simply hearing a cricket would constitute encountering one, as we know with quite a bit of certainty what a cricket sounds like and can therefore confidently identify crickets and recognize their presence simply from the sound. However, what hearing a cricket or a few crickets wouldn't tell you, especially if the ones you're listening to are in a cage on the desk of an entomologist, is how common they are out in the wild. Sure, they may seem really common if you consider only the cage filled with crickets, but it's a poor reflection of reality. Furthermore, you're essentially accusing me of making a hasty generalization (somewhat ironic, given that's ultimately what people are doing to argue in favor of this), but my argument is purely statistical in nature: the more runs I do without encountering the problem, the less likely it is that there's some rampant dilemma of this nature. I never denied that it happens at all, merely questioned the frequency with which it occurs. You may dismiss frequency as irrelevant, but nothing could be further from the truth. Virtually all problems and problem solving need to consider the frequency with which a problem occurs to help determine what is an appropriate response. In this case, the proposed solution is to institute some sort of minimum ilvl requirement for dungeons, even though there's already a level requirement and despite the fact that ARR leveling dungeons had no need for such things. In implementing this for what is essentially a rare problem at best, you'll inconvenience people who might slip in under any suggested minimum now without burdening their group, as these dungeons are quite easy and gear isn't particularly important. As I've said several times now, you have the tools you need to handle the problem if you encounter it already. There's absolutely no need for further restrictions simply because you'd rather whine than solve the problem

[Ama_Hamada]

EVERY DF in the game needs requirements, just because it is "rare" does not mean I enjoy carrying and stress healing undergreaed people.

I don't think it's necessary. I wouldn't consider Snowcloak an appropriate comparison either, as it was pretty deep in the level 50 endgame as far as dungeons go, which is why it has an ilvl requirement. Other ARR leveling dungeons did not as far as I know.

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Would be nice was running the Vault today and the healer was so under geared that if the first boss used his LB move on them it would one shot them and it took 3 runs getting lucky that they didn't get targeted to beat it

It is needed, every DF needs it.
Also every DF needs a WEAPON level requirement, and a stat level requirement (as in you need so much hp, so much main stat, to pass.)

average item level gates are too easy to exploit.

[Wolf_Heartnet]

Yes. 100% yes. Every dungeon and trial needs an item lvl req. Will prevent alot of rage and disbanded runs.

[Legion88]

Also every DF needs a WEAPON level requirement, and a stat level requirement (as in you need so much hp, so much main stat, to pass.)
average item level gates are too easy to exploit.

this can be easiely fixed by changing the min average ilvl into an absolute min ilvl and fixing the usability for accesoires to their stat users, like VIT-Accessoires are only equippable by tanks etc.
PvP-Gear can be excluded from this with an extreme low base ilvl and an reactivated moral in PvP. For example all PvP-Gears have only ilvl 150 but differing moral to bring them back to their actual ilvl+morale values.

[CyrilLucifer]

When you're healing a tank in Vault has i70-90 gear, I want you to tell me straight to my face that we don't need some system to prevent this in place.

Because this has happened to me.

[BarbaricImpact]

YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES!!!!!! This would cut down on the amount of people getting kicked, and save a party from wipes due to showing underleveled as all hell.