[Dev suggestion] More strict stat checks when entering duty finer/tutorial tests

[Ama_Hamada]

Just before maintanence, needed to do one last DR:Expert.

The DRG in the party was red dotting / dc'ing while in the first cutscene so scoped out their gear.They had a whole tonne of 260/270 stuff, both left and right side but their weapon was a.... True Ice Spear!

As in, the i110 lvl 50 Shiva weapon..

At level 60.
In a DR:Ex....

I mean.... This was a mistake right? Surely they were just trying on some glamour before they entered and they were going to switch when we started the dungeon...
Honestly won't know because they D/c'd after 5-10 mins of being stuck in the little force field thingy at the start so we couldn't finish our DR:Ex anyway.

As far as a stat check is concerned - I think there should be a "minimum weapon iLvl" check as well.. Weapon damage just accounts for far too much, regardless what role you are playing.
If you're a DPS, your damage is rubbish.
If you're a Tank, you can't hold hate.
If you're a Healer, your heals do very little and your nukes hit like a wet noodle.

You shouldn't be able to inflate your iLvl passed the DF if your weapon is trash because it just means too much.

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As far as actual substats - I don't think that is necessary.. Though I can see a main-stat check considering as a DPS you can toss on a whole bunch 270 of Mind or Vit accessories just to inflate your iLvl.

I did say weapon too in the first post. If my friend tells me a brd needs 630 skill speed or the dots are really bad, then there needs secondary total stats. Unless SE gets rid of accuracy making people have no choice in the matter on how the secondaries are disrupted

So a BRD was bad and they should be given gear with better stats because they're bad (?) so your friend/other healers don't have to worry about healing them (?).

I agree with that other thread about making a weapon weighted more heavily in the ilv, but I'm a little lost here.

No that is not what i am saying. I do not even know where you got that idea.

Because skill speed is so important to BRD, BRD gear is split between what is good for BRD and what is good for MCH. Also in general, accuracy sub stat makes how to gear so limited to begin with with the amount of gear we are given to pick from. Since you are basically dividing this because MCH and BRD are 2 different sets, there is little room to show people that do not look up weighs on what is good for them.

So to fix this one or more of the following should happen:
Split BRD and MCH gear, as in 2 different jobs, MNK and MCH do not wear the same thing, it is no different then making MCH have shared gear with BRD.
Get rid of accuracy. it makes it too hard to gear with our limited picks.
Balance the sub stats so it matters less.

Speaking as a white mage main, it's duty finder. You roll with what you get or you leave and try again. Might have to take a penalty if they won't kick you, but that's the risk you take.

There shouldn't be a "risk" the game should not allow it to begin with. Also this is not an option before a maint.

[Underdog2204]

Ghh I hate sharing gear with BRD... I cringe when I think of all the skillspeed I've got all of which is useless to me...

[Nestama]

Usually if a party I'm in DF with is having trouble, I'll give it a try and then discuss with them if we're having troubles we just can't seem to get past about abandoning so we can try again with others. If their attitude is bad, I'll just leave. I personally find hiding behind the "difference in playstyle" reason to be a baby about what you got in DF is pretty childish, but again, that's just me and why I won't do it. There are a wide variety of playstyles and ability levels in the game. I signed up for that risk of randomness when I used DF. If I want to outline parameters, I use PF.

I treat DF in a way where I expect everyone to work as a team and carry their own weight if the moment demands it (most of my DF's are this), not a 'you deal with what you get' way, as that can enable bad behaviour in players (they don't get 'punished' for being carried, so they think it's okay. Especially if you decide to leave when they become rude).

If I see a BLM using only Tier III spells (spamming Fire III and then spamming Blizzard III), I'll inform them that that rotation is not good and that casting Fire is better (or using Enochian and Fire IV in a F4x2, Fire, F4x2, B3, B4 rotation if in L60 content). If they ignore my advice, I'll bring it up again. If they ignore it again, or get rude about it, then I (try to) kick them.

[Ama_Hamada]

Ghh I hate sharing gear with BRD... I cringe when I think of all the skillspeed I've got all of which is useless to me...

exactly, that is what I mean, I do not get what confused you, Rokke

[TaleraRistain]

I treat DF in a way where I expect everyone to work as a team and carry their own weight if the moment demands it (most of my DF's are this), not a 'you deal with what you get' way, as that can enable bad behaviour in players (they don't get 'punished' for being carried, so they think it's okay. Especially if you decide to leave when they become rude).

Usually the ones who are rude are the ones who bitch about low DPS without trying to fix anything. I can count on one hand the number of parties I've just left. Usually after I open dialogue with my partymates we either determine we can't manage with current makeup or figure out what we need to adjust and continue on. I just have this really bad character flaw that when I make a commitment to something, which I consider joining DF to be, I hold to that commitment. Horrible, I know.

[Underdog2204]

Usually the ones who are rude are the ones who bitch about low DPS without trying to fix anything. I can count on one hand the number of parties I've just left. Usually after I open dialogue with my partymates we either determine we can't manage with current makeup or figure out what we need to adjust and continue on. I just have this really bad character flaw that when I make a commitment to something, which I consider joining DF to be, I hold to that commitment. Horrible, I know.

Mhmm sure
Me - "DPS is kinda low could you use some AoE pls?"
BRD - "Why? I don't have to and I've don't have them on my Hotbar"
Me - "Coz you'll do more damage when there are muliple mobs"
BRD - "I dont want to, you can do it instead"

Mhmm what terrible attitude I had, you may like enabling this behavior but alot of us certainly don't. Even the suggestion of dps being low is considered havng a "terrible attitude".

[AnaviAnael]

I'm really getting sick of the "it's duty finder" excuse. Yes, it's a group of randoms. Yes, most of them may not be geared well or have savage level DPS. That being said, it's not an excuse to place added stress on others because you either don't want to play at an average skill level or have inappropriate gear.

[Rokke]

So to fix this one or more of the following should happen:
Split BRD and MCH gear.
Get rid of accuracy. it makes it too hard to gear with our limited picks.
Balance the sub stats so it matters less.

The jump between the 1st paragraph (bads in roulette cause stress) and 2nd paragraph (less stat combos + remove acc + more stress talk + tutorial for level jumpers) is what lost me. I get you now.

You are correct that the two prioritize sifferent secondaries. I imagine as it stands, BRD/MCH share gear to keep inventory bloat (slightly) smaller. Splitting them would make my MCH gear more specialized, but I am not sure how much it would help healers suffering through bad players in DF. Gear will only carry someone so far.

[Nestama]

Usually the ones who are rude are the ones who bitch about low DPS without trying to fix anything. I can count on one hand the number of parties I've just left. Usually after I open dialogue with my partymates we either determine we can't manage with current makeup or figure out what we need to adjust and continue on. I just have this really bad character flaw that when I make a commitment to something, which I consider joining DF to be, I hold to that commitment. Horrible, I know.

Treating it like a commitment would then imply that you should strive to finish it no matter what (even removing something that would stop you), rather than leave the moment a bump crosses your path. At least, that's how I view commitment. It's also a teamwork environment, where you should expect everyone to commit to their roles as well. They don't need to be perfect (basic rotation should do), but they shouldn't be using weapons 10 levels below the content, nor should they be expecting three/seven others to carry them while they watch Netflix.

[Underdog2204]

The jump between the 1st paragraph (bads in roulette cause stress) and 2nd paragraph (less stat combos + remove acc + more stress talk + tutorial for level jumpers) is what lost me. I get you now.

You are correct that the two prioritize sifferent secondaries. I imagine as it stands, BRD/MCH share gear to keep inventory bloat (slightly) smaller. Splitting them would make my MCH gear more specialized, but I am not sure how much it would help healers suffering through bad players in DF. Gear will only carry someone so far.

Whilst I agreee it's still irritating to have two classes sharing gear that rely on different stats.

It's like having DRG and MNK sharing gear... :'(