[Tanks/Healers]: Are you disappointed there is no new job in 4.0?

[Reiryuu]

Hey all,

There was a thread a few days back I think where I posted a question I felt the devs would not answer (to my satisfaction) and it began to kind of derail that thread so I am making this topic for those who wish to continue to discuss it.

I have rounded up replies from the old thread, and put them here so that the discussion can continue.

The question posed was:

Why are tanks and healers getting left out in the cold with no new job? While it may be true that no one switched to tank or healers in large numbers, people who play tanks and healers like new jobs and some of us may have been looking forward to a new job in the same role and now feel kind of left out.

Personally, I find myself in this boat. I'm not completely satisfied with WHM and I don't have a lot of confidence that the reworks/balances will be enough to make the job seem new and different. Nay, it would be very odd if it did, IMHO. I cannot say how tanks feel about their upcoming changes, PLD in particular being called out, but despite the issues AST had, it was fun to play for a while and while I decided to stick to WHM, AST has become a fairly large powerhouse in some end game circles some saying WHM is the weakest of the group now as it has no raid benefits like AST's cards.

That said, new jobs are one of the biggest things I look forward to in a new expansion, and I knew from the get go that RDM wasn't going to be something I stuck with despite loving it in FFXI-- I know it will not heal in FFXIV nor be as diverse as it was in FFXI which will likely mean I will go back to being a healer in 4.X This mean that, as a healer, I don't really get a new class to play with and potentially switch to in my preferred role which, honestly, does disappoint me more than I would like to admit.

I would appreciate hearing your thoughts on this, but as always: Please keep it civil and respect everyone's opinions even if you may not agree with them. Thanks! *bow*

[Reiryuu]

Previous conversations (sorry if it's disorganized or I missed someone!) ><;

Because they are focusing on rebalancing the Jobs in those roles.

This isn't a bad excuse now, but if this stays the excuse healers and tanks are going to stop due to not having anything new to even try.

Also something like they found that adding new tank and healer didnt really affect the people playing healers and tanks in the long run, ie how queues are still role heavy leaning

But they're rebalancing *all* the jobs in 4.0 and, as I said, just because adding new tanks and healers doesn't get people to change jobs doesn't mean the people who play tanks and healers don't like new things too so why do we have to get left out? That doesn't really answer the question. Tanks and healers like new things too, but they decided to just give us the cold shoulder.

If people need to be given incentive to keep playing their role then it simply means they aren't dedicated. You shouldn't need a shiny new class to keep you convinced to keep playing your role.

What baffles me is anyone who mains healer complaining. Did everyone memory-wipe themselves of how bad AST was for a long while? Do you really want a repeat of it?

I've been hearing "Healers and tanks are gonna stop if you don't X!" since 2.0, dude(Though in 2.x it was mostly white mages bawwwing about holy getting nerfed). Turns out, we still have healers and tanks, and probably more than before.

I play Warrior alongside Monk and Machinist. And if we had a new tank, I probably wouldn't wanna play it. I'd prefer what we have is balanced to get better so all of them are viable- so that Paladins don't end up in a position like they are now, or god forbid, we end up with 3.0 Astrologians again. Poor things.

Perhaps but how many of the people on AST are still playing healers right now because we were bored of WHM and SCH and went to that. I know that is why I switched and atm have grown a bit bored of it as well. I am atm looking for a new job to play for 4.0 so while I can only speak for myself there is at LEAST 1 less healer that will be in the pool to pull from as I will be moving to some sort of dps or another and adding to that pool instead (idk which dps yet since I am trying everything to see what suits my fancy but something).



I am fairly big on healing. I was a healer in 1.0 (which all we had then was whm) I was WHM in 2.0-2.2 and SCH 2.2-2.55. I changed to AST in 3.0 and had decent success raiding on it. Healing is what I have always done in games even so far as tending to lean on being a healer even in single player RPG's where I control a single character (Tales of series, .hack series, FFXII, FFXIII, etc) but at some point I get bored. I like to try new things and work on mastering a new ability set. That doesnt mean I am not dedicated but if I am playing a game to have fun and am bored of a certain job I am going to find entertainment elsewhere be it another job in this game or a healer in another game.

[Kazrah]

This will probably be in 5.0, once all the dust has settled on the mechanics overhauls, not to mention that by focusing on DPS jobs, they could bring out the two most demanded jobs from players.

Now to answer the question as someone who both tanks and heals, I'm pretty content right now with what we options we have and I have faith in the dev team tweaking jobs like Paladin and White Mage so they have some higher use again.

[Venoshock]

as a tank main, no, not really because warrior for life bro. Its gonna suck when I'm playing ninja or bard on the side though because of Queues....but whatevs.

I do think it was a dumbass idea to give the dps role two of the most popular roles in ff history though that being samurai and redmage, considering the gross imbalance in role distribution. All it wuld do I make the imbalance even greater. They could of made a popular class like samurai a tank class to at least win some people over but nope.

I'm looking forward to my new tank mounts \o/

[Ceasaria]

What I think about healers reworked :

- Sch : Selene should be entirely reworked + some spells as Emergency Tactics, Dissipation
- Whm : Stoneskins II should be available in content, need more spells related to elements (water, wind and earth)
- Astro : Just rework this entire job, or nearly all. Remove the 2 stances. Remove all the HoT (excepted these from Collective Unconscious). Remove at least Balance and Arrow or it will be top job healer again. Make Shuffle 20 sec cd, add a hotbar to put cards drawn and choose if you want spread or solo when launched.
Keep instant cast concept and shield from nocturnal stance, make its shield act like a HoT which will be turn into SoT. It need a dps cycle more interesting.

If they could do this kind of thing, I will be happy even if we don't have a new healer job

[Tizzy_Tormentor]

MNK main, I expect the queues to be agony, but the idea is, whenever a friend is levelling a tank, we level our DPS with em, I plan to do my part.

I wish we got a new tank and healer, but I also agree with needing to balance them more, because as it is, things like PLD/DRK comps are simply not nearly as viable as anything with a Warrior.

One day I hope we get Chemist as a healing job, one day...

[Aylis]

I would appreciate hearing your thoughts on this.

To be honest, no I'm not disappointed in the least. With all the time I spent learning the ins and outs of my role, tweeking macros, learning what works, what doesn't. What i can get away with and what I can't pertaining to my group. I always say "if something isn't broke then don't fix it". I'd rather spend my time re-tweeking new skills to what I already know of my class then to start over from scratch completely, putting myself and my friends through me adjusting to new skills and the general learning curve of a different coat of paint when I'm doing just fine as i am now.

[NessaWyvern]

What I think about healers reworked :

- Sch : Selene should be entirely reworked + some spells as Emergency Tactics, Dissipation
- Whm : Stoneskins II should be available in content, need more spells related to elements (water, wind and earth)
- Astro : Just rework this entire job, or nearly all. Remove the 2 stances. Remove all the HoT (excepted these from Collective Unconscious). Remove at least Balance and Arrow or it will be top job healer again. Make Shuffle 20 sec cd, add a hotbar to put cards drawn and choose if you want spread or solo when launched.
Keep instant cast concept and shield from nocturnal stance, make its shield act like a HoT which will be turn into SoT. It need a dps cycle more interesting.

If they could do this kind of thing, I will be happy even if we don't have a new healer job

Please don't kill astro ;-; I like astro, I'm good at astro. I even like doing pvp as astro. ;-;

[Belhi]

I am disappointed but someone was inevitably going to lose out and its the healer and tanks turn this time. I would wish the excuses for why were simply left at that. The arguments trying to justify it just annoy me, in no small part because they are pretty poor excuses. I found Yoshi P's attempt to reassure the healers and tanks actually quite annoying since balancing the Jobs is something they should be doing anyway.

I do dread the queues and the hassles that go with them. I foresee myself having to rerun dungeons a fair bit to ferry dps from my FC and friends list through MSQ dungeons to avoid long queue times.

I think some people are expecting more from this combat revamp than we are likely to get. I am tempering my expectations because some people seem to expect a complete rework of the class designs and that doesn't seem likely to me. I think its very unlikely we will se any complete overhauls from what we have now. Alterations sure but fundamentally I suspect the Jobs will function much like they do currently. I might be wrong, for better or worse, but I will react to that when I have something to react to.

I suppose though it will be our turn for new Jobs in 5.0.

[Alywen]

to be honest, I am not dissapointed, before HW I mained Scholar and stayed Scholar, I play the Astro for fun in ex Primals. It would have been nice, but I don't need it ^^