Charging for runs.

[RubyCirha]

theres nothing wrong with it though it is a bit unsavory in my opinion but hey its up to you i men people sell runs all the time sometimes of obscene amounts of gil depending on the content and if you price it reasonable you could make a killing imo just dont be one of those jerks thats like sure ill run you through it for like 2 mill gill or 100k per person or something like that i mean max id go would be a tasteful like 20k per person or some ware along those lines i meen think about it 20k per person you run 2 dps thats 40 k a run and if you do that a few times a day like say 10 times thats 200k and do that for like the month of launch your looking at 6mill for 10 runs a day for 30 days thats not a bad haul for easy content

forgive the spelling

~ruby

and after rereading what i wrote lol it would be 12mill not 6, 6 is if it was 1 dps 12 if your running 2 at a time

[Aerowaffle]

Are you seriously arguing that Mitigation healing and Throughput healing are more similar than how a BRD and a BLM play? SCH is about keeping the group from taking damage and WHM is about bringing heal back up. As I said before, you never see an issue with SCH and WHM competing with each other for a healing spot because if you have a Throughput healer or a Mitigation healer you don't want another one in the Full party. There is a reason people aren't too keen when they get 2 SCHs in a full party.

And I am talking about styles of play, not the result that occurs.

If we're talking about the result, most DPS is the same, since they all deal damage (some more AOE oriented than others).

I'm talking about the actions of the player.

End result difference between throughput healing and shield healing? Tons. Which is why groups want one of each. But what is the actual play-style difference between giving a large heal after big damage and giving a shield heal before big damage? About a second of delay.

[Belhi]

And I am talking about styles of play, not the result that occurs.

If we're talking about the result, most DPS is the same, since they all deal damage (some more AOE oriented than others).

I'm talking about the actions of the player.

End result difference between throughput healing and shield healing? Tons. Which is why groups want one of each. But what is the actual play-style difference between giving a large heal after big damage and giving a shield heal before big damage? About a second of delay.

I am going to respectfully disagree with you on that part. You could argue that range and melee are different but caster and range really aren't particularly now BRDs and MCH have cast times. You use you AoEs when you need to AoE, single target when you need to single target, use procs when you have the chance and apart from that try to maintain your rotation.

If healing was all the same then AST wouldn't be the balance mess that it is.

[ADVSS]

ill pay no more than 30k a run. If its too little, ill use DF.

[Minnel]

When I was leveling my DRK at HW launch I had almost 5-10 minute queue wait times.

You GOT to be kidding me 5-10 minute que time... HOW HORRIBLE OH MY LORD. Kappa

[Lewtskie]

I am going to respectfully disagree with you on that part. You could argue that range and melee are different but caster and range really aren't particularly now BRDs and MCH have cast times. You use you AoEs when you need to AoE, single target when you need to single target, use procs when you have the chance and apart from that try to maintain your rotation.

If healing was all the same then AST wouldn't be the balance mess that it is.

Except the differences between healers mechanically is much more narrow than DPS.

A WHM has a specific action for a large heal, small heal, aoe heal. Sch much the same, while supplementing with their fairies actions. But mechanically you have a specific ability for these actions.

A BRD to perform properly and a BLM to perform properly are very mechanically different. They have very different ways of reaching the end result of taking down a large group of enemies or a single one.

Similarities of DPS will expand among Stat-types instead of distance of engagement. In a sense DRG(STR) and BLM(INT) aren't that different that their base mechanics being long combo chains, but beyond that they become much different. The same as MCH(DEX) and SMN(INT) both utilize an ammo mechanic.resource management, then branch out.

[Belhi]

Except the differences between healers mechanically is much more narrow than DPS.

A WHM has a specific action for a large heal, small heal, aoe heal. Sch much the same, while supplementing with their fairies actions. But mechanically you have a specific ability for these actions.

A BRD to perform properly and a BLM to perform properly are very mechanically different. They have very different ways of reaching the end result of taking down a large group of enemies or a single one.

Similarities of DPS will expand among Stat-types instead of distance of engagement. In a sense DRG(STR) and BLM(INT) aren't that different that their base mechanics being long combo chains, but beyond that they become much different. The same as MCH(DEX) and SMN(INT) both utilize an ammo mechanic.resource management, then branch out.

If healers are so similar then why have they been such a headache to balance for SE? They have been trying all expansion and in the end they just dealt with it by overbuffing AST. Your saying a class that specialises in mitigation, who's emergency heals work of a charge mechanic and who manages a pet is the same as one that just spams direct heals?

Your role in a group as a mitigation healer is notably different to main healing. You focus on minimizing burst damage while correcting with emergency heals and spot heals while trying to contribute to dps. How you do a fight is functionally quite different.

BRD AoE and BLM AoE aren't that different. Fundamentally both are spamming AoE attacks while maintaining a buff.

My point is if you want to start to split roles into categories you will find that it can apply to healing and tanking to due to how the meta works. I am not arguing that the dps getting two roles is unfair. Its disappointing but you can justify the reasoning to the end of time and it wont stop it being disappointing. Its just that with the meta, these justifications seem pretty hollow.

I am more annoyed that people seem to be trying to justify it than I am disappointed with the lack of a tank and healer. I also found Yoshi P's reassurance annoying cause frankly it also sounds pretty lame. Getting balanced Jobs isn't something we should be thankful for. Its something we should be expecting. Were they not going to balance the Jobs properly if we did get a new tank or healer? Same with the 'breathing new life into the roles'. Everyone is getting that. That's not something Tanks and Healers should be extra thankful for.

Now maybe he meant they have major overhauls to how the Tanking and Healer meta work but I am not going to believe that till I see it. Their design choices with Tanking and Healing were pretty hit and miss in HW and that doesn't show me they have learned how to deal with the meta design. If in two months they bring out some amazing overhaul and if so, fantastic. But I don't think that is what they have actually promised and until then I am going to remain sceptical.

Tanks and Healers are perfectly entitled to be disappointed. Currently the new Jobs are about half of what has been offered for us to get hyped about and for people not interested in dps they are both duds. Let them be disappointed and stop trying to justify the decision.

All this is kind of beside the point. How tanks and healers feel about it won't change the length of the queues. Tanks and healers will queue up for as many dungeons as they feel like doing and that is just the reality. Tanks and healers don't get a new job and DF queues for dps queuing without a tank or healer will be long.

And the demand will inspire tanks and healers looking for ways to make gil offer up their services. Some might do it out of spite but most I think will be doing it because the opportunity exists.

[XSamsaraLotusX]

So how many of this tanks will you ask to not play the new jobs to help you?

[XSamsaraLotusX]

If the wait time is 30m in the longest pont then ok. If it 1h+ then pay more like 100k or wait.
Its nothing personal just a bisnes.

[vigioX-Sun]

I wish I could just get commendation but pre made won't let that happen.
I'm 1k commendation away from hitting my 3k.
Who knows maybe the dps are thankful in DF an give it on so I'm getting my 3 tanks up even before any other class.