[DEV Question] Why is this allowed?

[Callinon]

So, you don't like it, that's why it needs to change, despite that's how SE purposely made the system for balancing.

Really? In an entire thread where everyone is moaning about how calculating average item level isn't good enough for entry into DF parties? This is what you're going with here?

SE purposely made average item level the determining factor for DF entry. But because you don't like it, it has to change.

Am I doing it right?

[JunseiKei]

Really? In an entire thread where everyone is moaning about how calculating average item level isn't good enough for entry into DF parties? This is what you're going with here?

SE purposely made average item level the determining factor for DF entry. But because you don't like it, it has to change.

Am I doing it right?

I asked why you said it needed to change while saying WD is a stat capper and brings balance to the game. You said the difference between WD and main stat is nuts and no stat should be worth as high as 25 times the next, which equates to.... you... don't like it...? I'm sory, that's all I was able to infer.

Also, the thread is pointing out how people are able to bypass an average item level system and still severely hinder the party or downright make it impossible, as per Miste's example here. Discussed solutions are not perfect, but are in many ways better than what we have now, as it's exploitable.

So, no, you're doing it wrong.

[Ama_Hamada]

Really? In an entire thread where everyone is moaning about how calculating average item level isn't good enough for entry into DF parties? This is what you're going with here?

SE purposely made average item level the determining factor for DF entry. But because you don't like it, it has to change.

Am I doing it right?

You are not doing it right. There is an issue here and that issue is exploiting the system to a point where people entering dungeons they are not ready for. I like to know why you have a habit of going to extremes to prove a non-existent point to fight what people are asking to change?

Not only does average needs to be met but each slot should have a minimum .
example (since we found weighed average can still be exploited)
current expert
Entry requirements:
weapon 220+
all other slots 200+
average level 230

it is not asking for a lot, nd ALL as in EVERY DF needs this

Sastasha:
all slots level 1+
weapon 10+
average, level 8

Anything under that, even in sastasha is not functional. I met a tank that was in level 1-5 gear and he was too hard to heal, even for me tying to full time it. It i way too stressful and I should not suffer a 30 min cooldown dealing with BS because people do it because they are allowed to.

We are not asking for stricter requirements to sound elitists, we are asking for higher requirements so people can function.

[ToasterMan]

You know what I don't get? Why does SE allow players to wear accessories that clearly aren't for their class (Healer wearing tank accessories to boost their ilvl) Why are the shire accessories all class? It makes no sense and it only leads to the issue that the OP pointed out.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

Bringing attention to a loophole is a thing. Stating a solution for that loophole is another. And frankly, I still think the problem here is that the weapon is too important. For example, we all know that accessories cost less tome than little pieces or armor, which in turn cost less that big pieces. It's because accessories give the least stat and big armors give the most.

But, with such a huge emphasis put on weapons, we could end in situation where upgrading several pieces of armor would give you less DPS than the weapon alone, even tough the weapon is clearly "cheaper".

Why shouldn't the weapon be weighted heavily? It's intended to be our highest contributing damage boost. Making it more comparable to accessories seems silly. I, likewise, don't see why requiring people to have say ilvl 220 gear equipped to enter a ilvl 230 fight is an issue. Reducing gear weight just to accommodate people too lazy to properly upgrade is precisely why people don't. They already lack the incentive due to how easy content is. This only further diminishes it.

[Blackbird1]

that's very annoying had a ninja get into a12n using 120 ironworks gear his dps was low as shit and even tried to blame myself and other dps for being bad when we were out dps'ing him and the idiot wasnt even doing mechs

[Nestama]

I wouldn't survive...because I didn't even have the average ilvl to enter Sohia EX. Yet I did enough DPS because I had a higher weapon.

But you wouldn't be able to replicate that in Sophia EX, as you would be dead most of the fight. Now swap that around with being in i255 gear and whatever ilvl your crappy gear was for the weapon. You'll be able to survive, but you go from being a glass cannon to a... well I guess tank stance DPS :I

That would have made sense...if only every piece of armor wouldn't add to your main damaging stat...

Barely. My i260 Anima has 65 more points of INT than my i270 gear :T

[Miste]

You realize that they changed main stat weight for tanks and that the world didn't crumble ?

Yeah the world didn't crumble with the tank change but do you realize the tank change was extremely minor? It only dealt with 2 stats and one role type. Also tanks DID lose some DPS, but since tanks don't really need high DPS (yes the community likes it, but the game doesn't require it), it didn't really affect much of anything.

Your change deals with all main stats and all jobs.

Also your idea changes SE's original design for the equipment system while mine only adds a few extra firewall rules to entry requirements for DF.

So, sorry, I still disagree that my idea is problematic compared to yours.

Mine only deals with DF entry requirements and not changing the original equipment system like yours does.

PS. Another thing is the Relic quest lines will become obsolete if weapon is the same as every other piece of gear. They won't be worth getting anymore if the weapon is only as good as an accessory piece. All that work for a piece of equip that does the same as a 375 Scripture accessory? Nope.

SE purposely made average item level the determining factor for DF entry. But because you don't like it, it has to change.

At this point you are just stuck on the idea that people want it changed simply because they don't like it and you are not actually adding anything to the discussion.

I pointed it out because it has a flaw. Liking or disliking it has nothing to do with it at all.

It is flawed if a player can go into a duty unable to do their main role. The DF should disallow players from queuing for something they cannot actually do properly due to lack of proper gear. The system mostly works; the only problem is the weapon being worth a lot more than other pieces.

So adding some extra requirements to the DF to acknowledge this imbalance will assist players from making mistakes not realizing they cannot do their role. Also would stop players who do it to troll or to get others to carry them so they don't need to do any work themselves.

Main point: People shouldn't be allowed to queue with gear that would make it so the team they get must carry them in order to clear the content or gear that would make it so if the team they get cannot carry them they will be completely unable to clear the content.

If I equip a level 50 i110 weapon on my BLM and queue for level 60 content I will be doing 50% less DPS than I should be doing for that content...who is going to do the extra 50% I am missing so we can clear? I guess we better hope the group I get can otherwise we are all going to waste time wiping all because the DF didn't check my weapon before letting me queue.

Did you look at my post about failing the DPS Alex Creator Normal (avg i230) check in SSS with an i110 weapon even tho the rest of my gear was 7 i270 pieces, 2 i260 pieces, and 2 i250 pieces? The weapon made it so my damage was not appropriate for the content. So if I go queue for it wearing that i110 weapon I cannot do the DPS I am required to do for the content no matter how skilled I am at the job.

Yeah, someone else might be able to pick me up and backpack me to a clear, but this shouldn't be happening simply because of improper gear which the DF queue system can and should be checking. If I get people who are unable to carry my low DPS then I wasted everyone's time by wiping the group over and over.

[LalaRu]

It's posts like these that allow someone to get away with playing like an Ice Mage in Dungeons.

I give you Kudos for the effors to dig 'em all!

Btw, OP is lamenting about a DUTY FINDER group. You know, a pug. A PUG. And, on top of that, of a duty they successfully done.

Tbh, this is more suited to an entitled elitism than a sincere concern about the use of duty finder. It feels to me as "I run with a PUG but I got people not geared as I demand they have to be. Fix that plox". Don't know if I need to laugh or cry.

I saw in the past people "cheating" the required ilevel using "exotic" accessories, but with a weapon, it is a first.

The proposal to require the weapon il as minimal is not viable, because when I level my characters from 1 to 59, hardly happened to get a decent weapon in the process, call it bad luck or anything else, but that proposal may lock away even legit people so it is difficult to accept as a solution, it is not uncommon to get a duty with a weapon not on par, while you are in your road to gear or level cap.

[Nestama]

snip

It's still a Level 50 weapon that is both 10 levels and 120 item levels below the content OP did. Even if it's just a PUG and even if they still eventually won (though since OP joined in progress, wipes most likely happened), why are you enabling bad playstyle and accusing OP for elitism?

If this were a tank and/or healer (bonus points if two/four) with the crappy weapon, wipes would be guaranteed and no progress would be made (especially in the unrealistic case of two tanks and healers with crappy weapons). A tank with a level 50 i110 weapon cannot hold hate against a DPS with a level 60 i255 weapon, for example. They wouldn't be able to hold hate from a single Cure.