DPS obsession in farm groups

[JunseiKei]

It's okay guys. I can cane smack all the mobs into oblivion, it will just take longer. A lot longer.



We might die. A lot.

EDIT:

You misunderstand, its not a crime to take minutes longer to finish a dungeon. Its a crime to not give a shit about trying then trying to justify it.

I absolutely need this as my signature. QFT.

[ElHeggunte]

Always a sad state of affairs when people defend ridiculous and hostile complaints about a difference of a few minutes to a fights clear time, even if that means having to put a bit more effort into a mindless routine. Your time is not as important as you think it is if you're wasting it being on this forum or playing the game.

Yup, there's a bunch of people on this forum that act like it's a crime if you cause them to spend an extra couple of minutes in a dungeon. It would be funny if it wasn't so sad.

The problem is those "few extra minutes" add up. If you're clearing a 6-minute fight in 8 minutes, after only three runs those extra two minutes would have equaled an entire extra run that you're now missing out on. And it only gets worse the longer you farm.

I don't agree with being openly hostile over a few extra minutes, but I also don't understand the mindset of people who think wanting to be efficient is a bad thing. To me, it's encouraging mediocrity if you're fine with tagging several extra minutes onto each fight because someone is sandbagging. Doesn't matter what the content is.

But for some reason this community seems to love wanting to give DDs a free pass for a poor performance. A tank can't hold threat or dies to mechanics because they wont use CDs? He's bad, replace him. A healer can't keep people alive? He's terrible, get him outta here! A DD is limp-wristing so hard that you're taking longer than you should to clear fights or are forced to deal with extra mechanics? Shut up and leave him alone, not everyone wants to speed-run. No.

[thegreatonemal]

The problem is those "few extra minutes" add up. If you're clearing a 6-minute fight in 8 minutes, after only three runs those extra two minutes would have equaled an entire extra run that you're now missing out on. And it only gets worse the longer you farm.



But for some reason this community seems to love wanting to give DDs a free pass for a poor performance. A tank can't hold threat or dies to mechanics because they wont use CDs? He's bad, replace him. A healer can't keep people alive? He's terrible, get him outta here! A DD is limp-wristing so hard that you're taking longer than you should to clear fights or are forced to deal with extra mechanics? Shut up and leave him alone, not everyone wants to speed-run. No.

Because as far as DPS goes how you rate bad performance is different for everyone its easy to point it out for healers and tanks because everyone tends to die after they mess up.

[ToasterMan]

The problem is those "few extra minutes" add up. If you're clearing a 6-minute fight in 8 minutes, after only three runs those extra two minutes would have equaled an entire extra run that you're now missing out on. And it only gets worse the longer you farm.

I don't agree with being openly hostile over a few extra minutes, but I also don't understand the mindset of people who think wanting to be efficient is a bad thing. To me, it's encouraging mediocrity if you're fine with tagging several extra minutes onto each fight because someone is sandbagging. Doesn't matter what the content is.

But for some reason this community seems to love wanting to give DDs a free pass for a poor performance. A tank can't hold threat or dies to mechanics because they wont use CDs? He's bad, replace him. A healer can't keep people alive? He's terrible, get him outta here! A DD is limp-wristing so hard that you're taking longer than you should to clear fights or are forced to deal with extra mechanics? Shut up and leave him alone, not everyone wants to speed-run. No.

I'm not encouraging people to not try and be efficient. I do the best I can whenever I go into an instance. As a healer main that means dpsing and all that when I can, but at the same time I know some healers aren't as comfortable with being all out battle mage. I'd rather not wipe because the healer went into cleric stance at the wrong time causing the tank to die. (Even though that's probably only a real danger in relevant raid content.

You misunderstand, its not a crime to take minutes longer to finish a dungeon. Its a crime to not give a shit about trying then trying to justify it.

Just because someone doesn't meet someone's expectations doesn't mean they aren't trying, or don't care about trying, but I think that's what some people in this community honestly believe. It's not that black and white.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

But for some reason this community seems to love wanting to give DDs a free pass for a poor performance. A tank can't hold threat or dies to mechanics because they wont use CDs? He's bad, replace him. A healer can't keep people alive? He's terrible, get him outta here! A DD is limp-wristing so hard that you're taking longer than you should to clear fights or are forced to deal with extra mechanics? Shut up and leave him alone, not everyone wants to speed-run. No.

This stems from the fact it is far easier to notice a poorly performing Tank or Healer. If they mess up, it'll usually result in deaths or an inevitably wipe. DPS, meanwhile, are only really noticeable if they die or fail a mechanic check. They can pull awful numbers, but unless you pay attention to their rotation, you probably aren't going to notice which one is the lame duck-- except if you're parsing. And that brings its own can of worms.

[DreamAngel-Ren]

No one stays til everyone gets their whistle anymore.

I have to disagree because recently I earned my Nidhogg bird (my 6th bird) from a group where everyone got their whistle

[JunseiKei]

Just because someone doesn't meet someone's expectations doesn't mean they aren't trying, or don't care about trying, but I think that's what some people in this community honestly believe. It's not that black and white.

When paired with the comment they are speaking to, you'll see where it applies. People genuinely think it's alright to play sub-par; I actually had this conversation with an FC mate, admitting he purposely slacks off in places like 24 man raids because, "there's 23 other people. It's not going to matter if I just use the same combo over and over."

People don't seem to get that playing poorly and sub-optimally frequently builds muscle memory and retention of undesired habits. Coupled with the fact that unless the DPS is so blatantly bad that you can easily spot the source of the issue, it goes unnoticed and passed off; or noticed, but unable to confirm where. Unless you use a parser, of course, which is against ToS. I suppose SE could go about adding hard enrages that have much stricter DPS checks to make a point. At the same token, as much as I'd love that issue to be pushed as a, "You see?" statement, I don't want the game to be a ghost town because people would rather whine, threaten to quit (or actually quit). Exhibit A: Gordias Savage and the raiding community; Exhibit B: Steps of Faith before nerf to hell and back for the MSQ and general player base.

Oddly enough, building such habits often leads one to think it's okay, even if passively, to play badly. Then when you need to play well, you won't; you've built up the habit to perform poorly. Then when others see those that push DPS, or trying to form good habits all the time, they are labeled as "try-hards." That is something my husband actually gets flack for all the time; he hates playing badly and does everything in his ability to do as much DPS as possible in all situations. This does not just apply in FFXIV- For Honor, Tekken, Street Fighter, King of Fighers, Dark Souls, Monster Hunter. The same principle is there.

[Cordie]

Well yes, that makes sense: more dps = more runs for the same period. I'll give you a fairly recent example:
farming condensation for the relic, we go in A1s as 4 tanks 2 healers 2 dds, and there is another group for A1s farm in p/f with 2 tanks 1 healer 4 dds and looking for a 5th. We do a run, get out, and out of curiosity I check the p/f again: they are in the same spot in the list, now looking for 2 dds.
So, yes: more dps = more/faster runs, definitely.

[ShikiRyougi]

when you start a farming party, it's for fast clears.if ppl wanted to farm at normal speed, they'd use duty finder.

[Underdog2204]

What makes me laugh is the way some people think they have a right to tell people what groups they should and shouldn't be a part of.

It's down to them, don't like it then that's your problem.