Lorewise, are Time Mages viable? [Discussion]

[RomildaRayne]

I've pondered this as well, and while Meteor, the BLM lb3 is black magic, I'd like to point out that Meteor, the spell used to call down Dalamud was more likely space/time magic. Additionally, while many of his abilities (and use of a staff for melee) paint Xande as a traditional Monk class (haven't done the FFXIV monk so I don't know if they apply to the ffxiv version) his use of the comet and meteor circle I always felt were time magic similar in use to a crossclass skill. While time manipulation magic isn't shown by them, space manipulation seems very much to be an Allagan thing.

If I'm not mistaken, Dalamud's descent, while achieved by harnessing aether, was primarily technological, which is why it was of interest to the Garleans. They intended to emulate black magic in spite of their natural ineptitude at aetherial manipulation; the proper spell gathers aether from one's allies and drops a crystallized mass of energy onto one's foes.

There's obviously a magical component, but I don't know if there's enough evidence to say it's time/space magic.

[Powe]

O btw the ascian we faced in the crysillus was able to bend space and time.

[Rocl]

It's worth noting, I feel, that Dalamud's descent was done by Eula/Nael van Darnus--who by the time we met her was fully capable of manipulating aether (probably through being Tempered by Bahamut, figure that out science!). Her manipulation of aether post Bowl of Embers in 1.0 was supposed to be a major hint that something was very wrong with this Garlean legatus but it was ... mostly overlooked.

There are three instances of messing with Dalamud I can think of, and only one can definitively be said to probably not have any magic involved. (It's Bozja, as we can't rule out either Eula/Nael or Xande not utilizing magic) The earlier days of Nael's attempt to cast Meteor might've been purely technological, like Bozja, but it certainly wasn't by the End of an Era.

[Shadotterdan]

Well it might have been technology from the Allagans, but it still was technology that manipulated aether. Also, thanks Romilda for the brief overview of how the BLM meteor works, which explains the main difference between the two versions. The Time spell variant warps space to bring the rocks/moon down. While not nearly as devastating as the Dalamud version, I'm certain that the variant the enemies use with the things we have to destroy is the time version

[Sylvain]

If they were to make a Time Mage (which I hope they will as it's my all time favorite class), I highly doubt they'd go for another healer. I think they'd make it a dps-support.
Having two "time related" healer focusing on buff is really redundant.

[ShikiRyougi]

It's a really long post, taking about 6000 characters, so I guess I'll have to post in a succession of replies.

I decided to bring this quite old discussion to the forums so that I would know every thought on people interested. Knowing FF XIV's current state and how the Role Trinity dictates every thing (Damage Dealers, Tanks and Healers, strictly) in it, would it be even slightly possible for Time Mages to be a thing? Let's see what you people think.

Here are my thoughts:
Some facts known that COUNTERS the idea of having Time Mages in the game:
• Astrologians already have control of time - or fate, for that matter. Their specialization lies in deciphering stars and bending space according to their personal Aether.
• Some of their spells are actually heavy references to common Time Mage's, like Gravity and Lightspeed (Haste), even though they are unaspected - thus being categorized as Arcane Magick.
• Yet about their spells: Meteor, a common Time Magick-schooled spell, is given as a Ultimate Limit Break to Black Mages, thus categorizing it as Black Magick.
• The Role Trinity wouldn't allow a class which is based only on buffing and debuffing allies and enemies respectively, thus rendering Time Magick rather "useless" or "less effective" than others.

Some facts known that SUSTAINS the idea of having Time Mages in the game:
• Time is known to be a "catalyst" Element, non-natural, in FF XIV. Although it's not something tangible or present among stats, Alexander's existence has seen to that. Thus, Time Magicks ARE possible to come, as much as we know.
• Time Magicks CAN be remade anew, as some of the Jobs and Classes we already know. For instance, Geomancers/Elementalists used to bear the power to control Water, Wind and Stone, natural elements of creation, instead of Conjurers, which came to be White Mages in the game.
• Technology is a quite recurrent feature in the game. Using corrupted Aether as engine to things, creating weapons that channel Aether into ammunition and ancient technology (Allagan) is a thing still unknown.
• Time Magicks do NOT necessarily have to come out of simple magic manipulation. They can be manipulated into being, be it by using catalysts, summons or steampunk-like technology.

MY POINT OF VIEW:

Although we know that Classes are more unlikely to come in the next expansions, with jobs like AST, DRK, MCH and RDM - the known most recent ones - taking the role of "Special Jobs", there is only a single Healing class in the game. People are forced to learn CONJURER 101 before anything if they want to heal; Even to get Scholar, that branches from Arcanist, they have to reach a specific level in CNJ (15, for that matter), and this is their - OUR - only healing experience before getting SCH itself.
More Healing Classes may come in time, giving actual CHOICES to people starting to play of whether you want to heal as a tree-loving magician or something else first.

Speaking in "time", we also know most classes/jobs have a deity among the 12 to which they can relate, Nymeia (and presumably Althyk) being Astrologian's, for example, and Nophica White Mage's. That can also be somewhat directly related to the classes starting cities, when not relating our Astrologian role to Ishgardian's. Althyk is the the god of Time among the twelve, Nymeia's older brother, and has no classes related to it (to my knowledge).
All this brings to light that there is, although little and darkened, fertile soil for Time Mages to grow - and I'm not talking about their Space Tarot Counterparts, the Astrologians.

Although most healers actually have similar play styles, they all differ in a point. White Magick is heavily based in pure healing, lifting people's HP bars to max with little to few difficulty, while giving them regen effects so that they can be mended by the power of the light. "Fae Magick", Nymian Spellweaving, is heavily focused on avoiding damage to be done, bringing sustain in the process by summoning Faeries and harnessing their power. Astrologians use their Arcane Magick to bend Fate itself to their will, while manipulating their own Aether between Light and Darkness to bring Benefic spells to help their allies or Malefic spells to wound their enemies. Their alignment with celestial bodies allow them to shape sunlight in renewing magic, like that of the WHMs, or moonlight in shrouding magic, like that of the SCHs.

Chronomancers, as can be called those who harness and control powers related to Time, could be simple Healing classes, based on undoing damage done in times past. While Astrologians are heavily focused in the future, Time Mages could fit in the game as healers specialized in rolling back what has happened seconds prior to the event of casting, intensifying healing based on damage taken for a specific amount of time. They could keep their buffs from other games, like Haste and Slow, yet focused in their stronger versions, which effects are party-wide. Space magic, like Meteor and Gravity, would no longer belong to them, giving space to a new range of time manipulation spells - take WoW's Warlock Doom, for example, which does a certain amount of damage after some time. Intensifying other debuffs on enemies, hastening their effects or delaying hazardous effects on allies, they could also prove useful supports. They could not necessarily use the same pattern for every magician - They could rely upon Aethered technology instead of using powers of nature/whatever those fairies come from. Wouldn't it be sick to see a healer using a magicked, sand-filled needle with a shield hologram as a weapon?

What I mean to say is that I believe - and that's my sole noob belief - that Time Mages ARE a viable class in FF XIV, if reworked appropriately. And, again, I'm not talking about looking at a Bole card and gluing it on your tank's forehead.

Those interested, please, discuss. Be it to prove me wrong and correct my mistakes, be it to agree with me and hope for possibly nothing. Enrich the post. Don't let it die.

And sorry for the spam. There'll be a lot of blank boxes - those are the deleted posts I created to divide those 6035 characters coherently in stacks lower than a thousand characters long. Thank you Anonymoose for enlightening me about hot to bypass that limit.

I'd just like to point out, SAM is also taking the role of special job, since you listed all the 4 others.

[ADVSS]

Just got my gigi minion, and so lore wise, i believe time mage could work, focusing on the allagan side of time magic opposed to the sharlayan rendition that astrologians utilize. There are many great visuals and resources used in the latest hildebrand, but I mean anything is possible, Sort of sad to see spells like gravity/demi given to AST which would make it a lot harder for them to do a time mage with most of its oconic appeal. Lightspeed is literally the quick 2 spell, for instance. Then the biggest and best things time mage was useful for -warp/reset the fight - that wont ever happen. As far as a healer using reverse spells, thatd be cool, but incredibly hard to balance(imagine popping reverse on the tank for a tank buster, while your co whm uses bene since his health dropped)

a low dps debuffer/support could work in some fashion, as like a caster version of brd/mch i guess...using time to roll back tp loss/etc. All in all it would be interesting to see, but i am a big fan of the iconic jobs so i just want to see as many as possible.