Is DPS'ing as a Healer Vote Kickable?

[Rennies]

Ugh, people still can't get it through their skulls that DPSing as a healer when the team will survive does in fact make you better than a 0 DPS healer.

Maybe I should take some names from this thread and just spam Ruin and unsummon my pet when I meet these people. You ignore your toolkit, I ignore mine.

[LuckiGoLucki]

Ah sorry, when I say "current healer" I mean the healer we have been matched with. In most cases where it's become an issue either the "offending" healer will straighten up or they will just leave because, as I said earlier, they don't like being told what to do.

[Rennies]

A damage dealer or tank who fulfills their primary role with minimal efficiency to clear the content is not a good player. A healer is not exempt from that, and to say otherwise is completely ignorant of how the game has been designed.

[seekified]

I'm just gonna leave this here...

[Sylve]

A damage dealer or tank who fulfills their primary role with minimal efficiency to clear the content is not a good player. A healer is not exempt from that, and to say otherwise is completely ignorant of how the game has been designed.

The fact that they're clearing content makes then a minimally good player. Just good enough to get by. If they tried, they could become a great player. Maybe even an excellent player if they really put effort in.

A bad player is one who fails duties, dragging down the players they're grouped with. There is no grey area with that. You can be 'good' enough to clear basic content. But any kind of 'bad' is enough to fail duties.

Choosing not to DPS as a Healer, or choosing to focus on the 'Tank' side of Tanking does not inherently make you a bad player. Not everyone is on the bleeding edge of skill and/or gear.

If you're attempting Savage level content, Then you can be expected to perform at the best you can, which includes maximizing damage dealing while Tanking and Healing. But thats about the only place anyone can reasonably expect others to be performing at max level.
In a random 4 man duty, expecting people to play as if they're facing a Savage Raid Boss is just arrogant. You're going to get all kinds of players with varying degrees of experience and skill.
Just because you have an overgeared friend or FC mate who manages to turn the DPS on full blast while keeping the party full in a 4 man duty does not give you the right to expect that of every single healer that joins you via duty finder.

[LuckiGoLucki]

The goal here is to teach, and to those who refuse to be taught, to change their attitudes. Take a couple minutes out of your day and teach a 0-Cursed healer what their job can really do. You know, pay it forward and all that.

This is the best way for all of us to go about this issue. We can all try to mention in chat how we think the instance might go faster/easier if the healer does a,b and c. If they fire back swearing vote kick them. If their playstyle is causing the team to fail, like without a doubt they are failing because of the healers actions or lack thereof then vote kick. The only thing I would ask everyone to consider is a person's comfort level in their role. My point here is that these kinds of things can take time an we should all try to take a gentle approach when confronting healers about their playstyle.

[GMERC]

If you're attempting Savage level content, Then you can be expected to perform at the best you can, which includes maximizing damage dealing while Tanking and Healing. But thats about the only place anyone can reasonably expect others to be performing at max level.
In a random 4 man duty, expecting people to play as if they're facing a Savage Raid Boss is just arrogant.

[Neophyte]

A bad player is one who fails duties, dragging down the players they're grouped with.
There is no grey area with that. You can be 'good' enough to clear basic content. But any kind of 'bad' is enough to fail duties.

So, outside of ex/savage content there are no "bad players"? I had one timeout once in Amdapor (nm) back in 2015 in a dungeon, so I guess there are only minimal good, good, great and excellent players out there?

Also I don't get why people judge the players instead of their actions.
Doing nothing is bad/lazy.
Doing overheal is bad/lazy.
Being lazy is bad.
If you're not dpsing and your party members don't drop like flies, you're most likely doing one of the above. Which is not "minimal good", it's just plain bad.


Saying bad players exist only in failed duties, is like saying that every player of a sports team (doesn't matter if professional or just for fun) is good, just because the team won. Hell, no.
A team can win, even if one of their players never touched the ball or didn't even attempt to go for the ball. And no.. this one isn't called "minimal good" play then.

Same in dungeons... if you're a SCH in some dungeons (with proper dps/tank) you can acutally do almost nothing. As a dps, you almost never fail a dungeon (unless you got kicked), if you don't attack at all, because 3 ppl are enough to clear any dungeon. So, if I auto-follow the tank and we still clear the dungeon, my auto-following was a "minimal good" strategy? Never ever.

Also we're not talking about "new players", "inexperienced players", because I think that the healers in this thread, mentioning they never dps, are neither new nor inexperienced.

"Minimal good" isn't a proper term, even... So Cure III single target (which still makes the target survive) is just "minimal good"? I always thought it's bad.

[Rita1989]

The only reasonable excuse not to DPS as a healer is your new and not comfortable with the job yet and even then you should gradually learn it on easier content like dungeons so once you get to harder stuff your used to stance dancing

[Watachy]

Also I don't get why people judge the players instead of their actions.
Doing nothing is bad/lazy.
Doing overheal is bad/lazy.
Being lazy is bad.
If you're not dpsing and your party members don't drop like flies, you're most likely doing one of the above. Which is not "minimal good", it's just plain bad.

Insert ~Apply cold water to that burn~ meme