Is DPS'ing as a Healer Vote Kickable?

[DinahDemiurge]

AutoWhit, how about you tell us what is good about standing and donig nothing. Please. How does this help the party?

[Watachy]

Being encouraged to do a thing is not the same as that thing being enforced.

Sure, lets a do a 30+ mins run when you can do it in 15 min. In one hand you have the healer that just learned to play a healer in this game, in other hand you have the slacker that don't wanna play the game and is actually a bother for 3/7/23 other people, great.

(not gonna mention people that are least trying, they just need practice)

AutoWhit, how about you tell us what is good about standing and donig nothing. Please. How does this help the party?

This gonna make my day, do it please.

[Zojha]

If no heal is needed and nothing big is coming, you have to DPS that's all.

Or more generally put:
Don't stand there doing nothing productive when you could be doing something productive instead.

In that form, it can be applied to tanks and DPS just as well - a tank shouldn't just build an aggro lead and then /mandervilledance until the DPS catch up. He should keep doing something in the meantime and ideally something efficient. Likewise, a DPS should not be content doing its role by autoattacking, but rather supplement that damage via skills when they become available, ideally in an efficient way.

To me, that rule is pretty much common sense and role-independent.

[Cinno]

Please, someone point out to me where it says a player is "expected" to perform abilities outside the role they signed up for:

http://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodest...in/party_play/

It's not outlined by square enix, but it's rather outlined by the community. That's the thing about MMO's see.. the game developers do in fact make rules and guidelines.. but the community develops their own additional rules and expectations. That's part of the thing with MMO's, a massive community plays it, and shapes it. Is this your first MMO or something?

Regardless, feel free to do the absolute bare minimum. Have a tank stop doing skills once they've established Agro. Have DPS in your party just do auto attacks. That isn't fun for me, but obviously that seems acceptable for you.

[Vurtney]

Kicking players for fun for differing playstyles and getting away with it.

I'm totally not going to abuse this. At all. Ever. Maybe.

[Taika]

Or more generally put:
Don't stand there doing nothing productive when you could be doing something productive instead.

In that form, it can be applied to tanks and DPS just as well - a tank shouldn't just build an aggro lead and then /mandervilledance until the DPS catch up. He should keep doing something in the meantime and ideally something efficient. Likewise, a DPS should not be content doing its role by autoattacking, but rather supplement that damage via skills when they become available, ideally in an efficient way.

To me, that rule is pretty much common sense and role-independent.

This, exactly! For a healer, this means covering the healing requirements of the duty and then, when you cannot meaningfully contribute by healing anymore (without overhealing), you should contribute by doing DPS! This is the baseline. Only healing and not doing DPS does not reach the baseline. Optimal play would be taking this one step further: using your abilities in a skillful manner that minimises the time you need to use on healing (while keeping everyone alive) and pushing as much DPS as you can.

[Sylve]

AutoWhit, how about you tell us what is good about standing and donig nothing. Please. How does this help the party?

It doesn't. By the same token, It doesn't hurt the party either.

Assuming all 4 members of the party are achieving their primary role, a duty will succeed. The speed at which this happens depends on how well the party does with secondary roles (except DDs, poor bastards only get to kill things).

Its a skill floor and a skill ceiling kind of system.
If a Healer is only capable of healing the party, They're standing on the skill floor.
If that Healer can keep the party alive while maintaining a steady output of damage, they're reaching for the skill ceiling.

Standard duties are designed with the consideration that 4 players standing on the skill floor can clear it. However, 4 players reaching for the skill ceiling in that same duty will be able to clear it much more effectively/efficiently.

All I'm trying to point out is that there is nothing inherently wrong with a Healer who doesn't throw down DPS during downtimes. Just as their isn't anything wrong with a Tank who isn't dancing in and out of tank stance to maximize their damage output balanced against their enmity generation and damage taken.
They're not going to be the best players, but as long as they're not failing your duty, why does it matter that it took you 5 extra minutes to clear? If you want speedruns, make your own parties and set your own rules.

[Arg0n]

Also, I still haven't gotten an answer as to why we queue as tank, or dps, or healer.

Assuming all 4 members of the party are achieving their primary role, a duty will succeed.

Ok, so you think a healers job is just to heal and do nothing else? This means, 2 buttons are enough for almost every 4-man dungeon.
Let's take cure for single heal and medica for aoe heal. He's job is done.

Now we have a tank. He's job is to keep enmity. Warrior as example. he can just spam overpower and butcher's block. 2 buttons are enough to keep enmity.
Sure he makes no damage and receive a big amount of damage, but he keep the mobs. He's job is done.

And the damagedealers? Well, they don't need to do special rotations or skills or dps. Their job is just to do some damage, which amount doesn't matter.
Lets take a summoner and blackmage. Summoner only cast ruin is entire life, and the blackmage does only ice.
They do some damage, but it's nothing compared to a full rotation. But they are doing their job -> damage.

Now you have a full group and everyone is doing his job. But instead of 15-20min, they need about 40-50min for a dungeon, or can't even beat it.

Is that what you want? Is this your expectation of "just do your job"? Cause everyone is doing is job, if it is good or not doesn't matter for you?

[Alistaire]

It's important to distinguish between 'ideal MMO design' and what is currently present in FFXIV. I think healing should be intensive enough that it's a full-time job, but that's not how FFXIV is designed.

This needs to be emphasized so much.

When you refuse to dps as a healer in this game you are being willfully ignorant of how this game is designed.

[AutoWhit]

It's not outlined by square enix, but it's rather outlined by the community.

Thank you. This is exactly what I wanted to hear.

I never said once that I'd complain if a healer is dpsing or not. I am pointing out that I won't complain, or call out, any healer that isn't dpsing. Would I prefer to have a healer dps? Sure, who wouldn't? Do I care that they are not? No.

I am a part of "this community," and I choose to focus on my own play, and be as good as I can be in any situation. If that means picking up my dps when the group seems slow killing things then that's what I do....that is my job as a dps....to adjust. I am accountable to myself as far as being the best I can be at what I do. I do not, and cannot, expect anyone else to think the way I do, or play the way I do. This is how I choose to "shape" my community.