No Community

[RiyahArp]

I think the tools are there for people to forge connections if they want to forge them.

The difference in the older games was that you didn't have these tools, but the games themselves forced social connections through gameplay. Here, you have some tools, but you could theorectically do the game entirely solo apart from anonymous pickup groups and not miss a thing.

And the tools have gotten worse. One of the reasons I hate Discord is that it removes social interaction completely from the game onto other mediums. Yeah, they did have teamspeak in the old days, but it generally was limited to raid nights. But Discord is everything now; every FC has one where half the members chat in, and things like pvp no longer use linkshells or fcs, but discord instead. A lot of old MMO socialization was done in game in event hubs.

The games have changed a lot to be much more antisocial in gameplay, and tools tend to take people out of the game to socialize.

[Vidu]

The difference in the older games was that you didn't have these tools, but the games themselves forced social connections through gameplay. Here, you have some tools, but you could theorectically do the game entirely solo apart from anonymous pickup groups and not miss a thing.

And the tools have gotten worse. One of the reasons I hate Discord is that it removes social interaction completely from the game onto other mediums. Yeah, they did have teamspeak in the old days, but it generally was limited to raid nights. But Discord is everything now; every FC has one where half the members chat in, and things like pvp no longer use linkshells or fcs, but discord instead. A lot of old MMO socialization was done in game in event hubs.

The games have changed a lot to be much more antisocial in gameplay, and tools tend to take people out of the game to socialize.

How - or why - is that so bad though? What do you gain from being forced to socialize like that? Whats wrong with using a more convient tool (like Discord) than the ingame-chat to stay in touch with your friends? I've got a few friends that I only talk to ingame and its extremly annoying to basically just be online and afk to wait for them to log in if all you really want to do is chat, not play the game.

I dont see the benefits of enforcing more socialising - after all this is a game we play in our freetime to do something we enjoy.
If you enjoy hanging out a lot with other people, you can do that.
But if you enjoy the game more for its gameplay, its great that you can absolulty do that too.

I have an active FC, a handful of good friends to play with, even a static - and I barely play content alone, but once in a while its quite enjoyable that I can.
We keep arguing that more options are always great when it comes to glamour and stuff - why does this not hold true for fundamental ways to play the game? Its not like the game is not giving you the means to form social bonds - its just not kicking everyone who doesnt want to do that out...

[Magic-Mal]

The difference in the older games was that you didn't have these tools, but the games themselves forced social connections through gameplay. Here, you have some tools, but you could theorectically do the game entirely solo apart from anonymous pickup groups and not miss a thing.

And the tools have gotten worse. One of the reasons I hate Discord is that it removes social interaction completely from the game onto other mediums. Yeah, they did have teamspeak in the old days, but it generally was limited to raid nights. But Discord is everything now; every FC has one where half the members chat in, and things like pvp no longer use linkshells or fcs, but discord instead. A lot of old MMO socialization was done in game in event hubs.

The games have changed a lot to be much more antisocial in gameplay, and tools tend to take people out of the game to socialize.

No the games are fine. Chats, linkshells, grouping, and FCs are all the basic tools any MMO probably had back in the old day that you loved. It's not the games. It's Discord and 3rd party media. You said it yourself and you have a point.

Because we have things like Discord, Facebook, Tumblr, Reddit, Twitter, and many more, there is no reason for a player to use the world chats, linkshells, or FCs like they would have probably 14 years ago. Back then they were forced to use the in-game tools. Because there was no Discord for example. Now it exists, and FFXIV's tools are outshined. I mean heck, we even have the Marriage Hookup Thread set up like a dating app so people can quick meet instead of just finding partners out and about in the game. Again, another 3rd party source of contact.

This isn't FFXIV's fault. This isn't Yoshi's fault. Blame social media and future times.

[HyoMinPark]

The difference in the older games was that you didn't have these tools, but the games themselves forced social connections through gameplay. Here, you have some tools, but you could theorectically do the game entirely solo apart from anonymous pickup groups and not miss a thing.

And the tools have gotten worse. One of the reasons I hate Discord is that it removes social interaction completely from the game onto other mediums. Yeah, they did have teamspeak in the old days, but it generally was limited to raid nights. But Discord is everything now; every FC has one where half the members chat in, and things like pvp no longer use linkshells or fcs, but discord instead. A lot of old MMO socialization was done in game in event hubs.

The games have changed a lot to be much more antisocial in gameplay, and tools tend to take people out of the game to socialize.

Where in my post was I talking about Discord? Nowhere. I use both in-game and outside features to talk with the people I want to talk to - in-game features when I'm logged in, and outside features when I'm not logged in. I was more so addressing this idea of trying to force interactions and force a "community feeling" onto people who may not necessarily want that.

The irony is you're blaming social media for this; for me, personally, I've never been active on any social media platform. I'm more active on this forum than I ever have been on the personal Facebook I've had for a decade, surprisingly. Some people would just rather do their own thing, or pick and choose their interactions. As I said before, I don't consider that a bad thing.

I know a lot of people loved FFXI, and like to compare XIV to the way XI always did things, but XI was also in a different era. Considering I’m not a very social person, and never have been, I would not have enjoyed XI, nor done well in it. But that’s fine. I’ve never really been a big gamer — FFXIV is my first MMO I’ve ever stuck with for a long time — and I tend to prefer doing a lot of things on my own without forced interactions between me and other people.

[Gemina]

This isn't an issue for me. I'm here to play the game. I have a tight knit of peeps I keep close that includes FC mates, LS, and a couple of RL friends. I am always open to meeting new people, but in this day and age I'm surprised people meet at all. Both inside and outside the game. I actually don't blame SE for the lack of social interaction at all.

[XiXiQ]

I think the main thing missing isn't the community itself, it's the tools to find like-minded people in game. Even figuring out how to join a FC is a pain if you don't know anyone in it already. There's no way in game to find linkshells that might interest you either.

[Usho]

#Necrobump

[Seig345]

This still seems to me to be a conflict in what one wants out of an MMORPG.

The point in an MMORPG someone enjoys playing is not necessarily "The People", the point is whatever it is about the MMORPG that the player enjoys. I'm not saying people shouldn't criticize a game for lacking something they want, but that goes both ways; no one can simply lay down the absolute "Point" to any game or genre of games that objectively makes them enjoyable to anyone.

Personally, I like that there is in fact NOT always "another carrot" if I catch up to where I want to be in the game. I don't feel like it's an endless slog, I can take breaks and spend time playing other games with the limited free time that I have. But because it's an MMORPG, when I -do- play, I'm playing with other people who are playing the same game as myself. I still get together at a friend's house about once a month and we have pizza and play FFXIV together under the same roof, and often find ourselves playing together every weekend or so during the rest of the month. Meanwhile during the week I can still progress where I want to progress without my friends, but rather with other people who are playing at the same time as myself.

So again, I don't believe that FFXI or FFXIV can be objectively declared as "superior" over each other, they simply cater to different demographics of players.

[Elixirboy]

I played XI for a number of years, and when I look back at it, I tend to think of it as the golden age of my online gaming life. My friends, the two LS I was in, the zones, the music, the whole game. When I was actually playing the game, day-to-day life was very ordinary. Sure, there was the occasional outstanding moment, like killing a particular HNM for the first time, or helping a friend through a particularly difficult fight.

My feelings about that game changed drastically as time passed. When I started playing XIV, I felt that it paled in comparison. I stopped and thought - maybe it's because I'm in the middle of my XIV experience, and perhaps my feeling about this game will be very different ten years from now.

Many years from now, I may feel that both games were equally incredible - but I try to not think about it. It may be that the OP is looking for something that cannot exist, but that's not for me to say.

[Omegabear]

I don't socialize in MMO in general so I'm actually glad for the single player like aspect of the game. I'd rather not be stuck with having to join a guild due to certain raid requirement. I absolutely don't mind challenging game content, but I do mind having to work with elitists and others that I'd rather not associate with. Even the best of guilds usually have a few of those people unfortunately so I find them unavoidable unless I make my own guild, which I no longer am interested in doing. Those that are genuinely interested in helping people are too few.