Thread: Healing responsibilities after 1.20

Originally Posted by Junpei

I didnt mean to imply he would take cons job, I meant it would simple make con's job easier and there for allow him to throw in a couple of those nukes hes got laying about as he wont be require to heal the entire party, just the paladin.

con nukes are only nukes if they have power, as of now there are no nukes in the game.

Originally Posted by HiirNoivl

Those are debuffs, not nukes. The same can be accomplished by food, and other skills. I doubt these will be used by conj.

They are nukes that provide a debuff effect when used as part of a combo. Exactly as I stated previously.
And yes, the same can be accomplished with food. and then AMPLIFIED FURTHER with these effects.

DD can't cure themselves.

Do you really think, in a party situation where debuff actually matters (boss or NM, not grind parties), that Conjurers will be spending MP on doing combos for a possible Debuff instead of curing that party?

That would have to be one heck of a debuff. Curing is very important. Unless all the mobs can be like Ifrit and DD never get hit, conjurers will be curing and buffing with stoneskin exclusively.

Shouldn't that be the White Mage's job, while Conjurer can perhaps do both?

YoshiP has already expressed his distaste for the idea of hybrid jobs/classes. While Con will have some nukes and debuffs, THM/BLM will always be the best nuker/debuffer. It would be contrary to his stated position to give CON/WHM nukes and debuffs that are on par with THM/BLM

Originally Posted by HiirNoivl

DD can't cure themselves.

Do you really think, in a party situation where debuff actually matters (boss or NM, not grind parties), that Conjurers will be spending MP on doing combos for a possible Debuff instead of curing that party?

That would have to be one heck of a debuff. Curing is very important. Unless all the mobs can be like Ifrit and DD never get hit, conjurers will be curing and buffing with stoneskin exclusively.

Then they should have been given cure-based combos. That's why I believe CNJs will only need to heal the party in an emergency.

If cure bombing is the concept for CNJ, why weren't they given lone nukes and cure combos with buffs for the party? Say, a single-target cure followed by a protect spell that adds a stoneskin effect, or the other branch from the cure where they cast a a shell spell with Aquaviel effect that allows for lowered magic damage.

There are a lot of ways to cure oneself in 1.20. In 1.21 it'll become even easier to cure a whole party with fewer spells. Additionally, the Paladin has a spell that cures 50% of the target's health along with a portion of their own. The regen effect from the other Pld ability and Whm's regen spell.

Whm hasn't always been a job to stand around and wait to cure. If they have nukes, and an exclusive ability to boost nuke damage, they should be able to use them. And basic curing should be a group effort.

But that's why I asked to hear SE's vision on the matter. Obviously they gave them AoE exclusive debuff nukes for a reason. It'd be nice to hear what that reason is if the only spells they actually ever cast are cure and stoneskin. If its only to solo then they'd be better served with fewer nukes and more healing/buff spells.

SE needs to look at how EQOA, not EQ I or II, classes were balanced. That MMO had 3 types of healers, and all kinds of other types of class. Not 1 single class was useless, every one could be found at a raid.

I understand what you're saying. Until implementation/more info we're kind of assuming a lot.

I just feel like giving conj nukes on par with thm would be hypocritical for Yoshi. And if a conj is not curing and casting subpar nukes in a party, it's really not a very good situation. I'm not against the idea of a Conj that can nuke too.

I just thought Yoshi was.

Originally Posted by HiirNoivl

YoshiP has already expressed his distaste for the idea of hybrid jobs/classes. While Con will have some nukes and debuffs, THM/BLM will always be the best nuker/debuffer. It would be contrary to his stated position to give CON/WHM nukes and debuffs that are on par with THM/BLM

I think there are far too many unknown specifics to state that CON will not be casting these debuff-nukes during important battles. Several factors will come into play, such as the MP cost of these spells, the MP cost of the cures, the proc rate of the debuffs, whether or not a successful combo mitigates casting cost of the finishing spell, and the accuracy and damage output of the party.

As for hybridization, I think you should look at the ability lists. Several classes are bringing some kind of debuffing ability to the table this time around. If you think that THM is going to be doing very much in the way of debuffs, then you may want to take another look at the 1.20 ability list. There does not appear to be a single class that specializes in debuffs. They have, at least for the time being, split that mechanic between classes. PUG will Slow and Blind, Archer can Blind and place DoTs, Bind, Stun, and Heavy are on a few classes, and effects as valuable as ACC+ and DMG+ will not be passed on unless their cost outweighs their benefit in the encounter.