Request to unlock Hempen set styles

[Luxyn]

It will only bother you if you're over-sensitive, so you saying "No! I don't want them to have that because I won't like seeing it" is far, far less of a valuable opinion. You're entitled to your viewpoint, entitled to express it, but in THIS context, it is less valuable than the one of those many players who do want something like this. I say this as a gay male player who while I personally don't like dresses, if someone else wants to wear that, male or female, that's not going to bother me.

[Luxyn]

If you put the potential happiness this would bring some players on one side of a scale and put the bother of those who mind on the other side, the happiness would outweigh the bother. And that is why I am *FOR* it.It shouldn't bother you in the first place. Just avert your eyes. It's really that simple. You don't need to change your opinion, keep it for all I care. But I'm going to let you know that it has less value in this discussion than the players who harmlessly want more self-expression that is really none of your concern unless you're overstepping.

As for the original intent of this thread, I fully support this suggestion. Yes please, and thank you! =D

[Miste]

But I'm going to let you know that it has less value in this discussion

Saying someone elses opinion is of lesser value than your own or others is pretty disrespectful tbh.

You don't have to agree with him, even I don't agree with him (I would be fine if they lifted gender restrictions), but you need to respect others.

So disagree with the opinion, debate the opinion, but don't label other's feelings as lesser value than yours...it's not very nice.

[Luxyn]

I really don't care if I come across as not nice towards this person. But I always try to be as nice to everyone as possible, and that includes right now. Is he being "nice"? I wouldn't say so. Nowhere did I say I don't respect his opinion. I do. He's entitled to it, to express it. I respect he feels that way. He's allowed to not like seeing men in dresses. To be oversensitive if it really bothers him so much (It *is* oversensitive). I never said otherwise. But there is something a lot of people don't seem to understand about opinions: They DO have value, and how valuable they are is all about the context. When it comes to someone else's freedom to express themselves, his opinion that he doesn't want to see it is less valuable because it doesn't actually effect him as much as it effects the person wanting to express themselves. To put it another way, because he isn't as effected he has less say in the matter. It's as simple as that really.

[Lukha]

I don't want to see men running especially in those (wedding) dresses.
[snip]
And as a _male_ WARRIOR OF LIGHT, it doesn't fit to the lore that you play some princess in a wedding dress or in any dress at all.

It almost sounds like you're specifically hung up on the fact that it's a WEDDING DRESS (even though it's technically an Eternal Bonding dress); is that, for some reason, a problem for you? Maybe the same sort of problem that people had that resulted in 'marriage' being renamed to Eternal Bond, and the official announcement for it having some hilarious assertions that the tradition was totally NOT just for couples, sometimes close friends would do it as well?

If we were to just call it an evening gown, would that help you at all? Sometimes changing your terminology can help you get past a hangup like this.

If not, well, I'm sorry to say that even if you don't want to see it, male characters in this game can already put together some pretty amazing outfits. here's my attempt at a wedding dress:



It would certainly be better if I had access to something more veil-like and maybe a slightly longer skirt, but I don't think I did too bad!

comes off to me as a nasty Trump rally. May not be the intent but thats how it comes off.

Please don't do that. Normally I'm all for talking politics but assuming who people voted for, (or couldn't be bothered to go out to vote for but somehow felt they had the right to pitch a tantrum over not winning after the fact) is both very unwise and not even remotely relevant to this topic.

stuff

In the future if you have a lot to say, you can get around the character limit by editing after you post. It keeps the pages tidier.

[Luxyn]

Ah, thanks for that Lukha! I was wondering how there posts with much bigger walls of text than mine. Sorry for the multiple posts. XD

[Miste]

I really don't care if I come across as not nice towards this person. But I always try to be as nice to everyone as possible, and that includes right now. Is he being "nice"? I wouldn't say so. Nowhere did I say I don't respect his opinion. I do. He's entitled to it, to express it. I respect he feels that way. He's allowed to not like seeing men in dresses. To be oversensitive if it really bothers him so much (It *is* oversensitive). I never said otherwise. But there is something a lot of people don't seem to understand about opinions: They DO have value, and how valuable they are is all about the context. When it comes to someone else's freedom to express themselves, his opinion that he doesn't want to see it is less valuable because it doesn't actually effect him as much as it effects the person wanting to express themselves. To put it another way, because he isn't as effected he has less say in the matter. It's as simple as that really.

Yeah and I am saying don't stoop to his level if he isn't being nice etc. Make our side look good with respectful justification.

Opinions have value, but basically to have a legit opinion about gender restrictions in FFXIV you just need to be actively playing FFXIV (gender restricted gear is accessible even from level 1). That's the only requirement for your opinion to have value in this discussion. It isn't like we are talking about Savage content and someone piped up with an opinion about it who has never experienced Savage content even once...this is just an aspect of the game (gear, glamour, and character appearance) that is experienced by everyone as soon as they start playing it. So again you shouldn't say other's opinions have lesser value.

He has just as much say in the matter as everyone else here since he plays the game even if we don't agree with him. I definitely don't agree with him at all either, but yeah don't stoop to that.

I agree with Luhka about the wedding dress points. It isn't a real wedding dress..it is a dress that was made for a fantasy ceremony in a game.

I mean what makes something a "wedding" dress? It isn't the colour white...because I've seen many formal dresses irl that were white called "evening gowns" or "prom dresses" so they are white but obviously not really made to be wedding dresses. It is only a wedding dress if you decide for yourself it is one. So I agree this doesn't seem to be a good point to be against lifting restrictions.

[Luxyn]

I understand what you mean there, and fair enough. And yes, his opinion does have value I agree but I'm going to have to disagree that he has as much say on what someone else should have available to wear as they do. It's their character. Just like in real life he doesn't have a say what others wear. That's where this comes from. It's not double standards IMO, that it would be more fair for him to end up having to see the occasional male character in a dress than it would be for players who want that to not get that option.

[Lukha]

Another point to consider is that not everyone will want to use the feminine items FOR serious glamour. I'm sure some people would love to use the items for silly, comedic glamours as well, just like people use the various silly animal costumes we have. There's nothing wrong with either useage!

People get awfully salty in this game sometimes; having a party member cosplaying Hildebrand in a dress would certainly provide a much-needed mood lightener.

Don't you want people to laugh and be happy, Gororo? Why don't you like fun?!

[Luxyn]

Another point to consider is that not everyone will want to use the feminine items FOR serious glamour. I'm sure some people would love to use the items for silly, comedic glamours as well, just like people use the various silly animal costumes we have. There's nothing wrong with either useage!

People get awfully salty in this game sometimes; having a party member cosplaying Hildebrand in a dress would certainly provide a much-needed mood lightener.

Don't you want people to laugh and be happy, Gororo? Why don't you like fun?!

This. Very much this. It's a game, it's meant to be fun. If seeing a man in a dress really annoys you, you gotta lighten up. xD