Thread: Another Platform primal in 3.5, is this how all of them will be in the future jc?

Originally Posted by ErryK

Thordan and Nidhogg are the only two primals where you

Falling off a platform isnt a display of skill tho in my opinion its just an annoyance , and I also havent done these either so the get good before Ive even done them is unwarranted. I was just asking a question on what was with the sudden change in approach, that all of them are platform based fights.

People die in The Chrysalis, Urth's Fount, The Minstrel's Ballad: Ultima's Bane, the mechanics here can make it to where even a hard mood trail can make people die Ive seen it several times. I've seen many people die to Shiva extreme mechanics, another player said they have only cleared ramuh once, and it doesn't have these mechanics I said in my post I didnt say remove this Im just asking where are just the ground based ones in comparison. And lets not act like lag isnt apart of this game they have had to address this issue several times just sense Ive been playing alone on these type of fights having any lag just makes it a pain.

Originally Posted by bswpayton

Falling off a platform isnt a display of skill tho in my opinion its just an annoyance

Falling off platforms is just as big a display of skill (or lack thereof) as standing in damage dealing AOEs. The only difference is that it's incredibly obvious to your whole party that you fell off a platform, while you might be able to fly under the radar if you stand in an AOE.

Originally Posted by Dzian

Most of the old school mmos did had this. fights were a lot more random and a lot less scripted. Using its predecessor XI as an example. you had proto omega. that might use a citadel buster on a tank once in the entire fight. or 3 times in the same minute. or he might put up manashields almost back to back crippling your groups magic damage, or he might never use them giving your mages free reign.

Citadel Buster is not the best example, as that particular ability was NOT random. It was on a strict timer, used regularly starting once the boss reached 20% health. (Also, it was actually Proto-Ultima that used it.) Armor Buster is a better example - while not as lethal as Citadel Buster, it was still pretty bad, and Ultima randomly chose between it and several other TP abilities. While the odds were against it, it COULD use Armor Buster several times in quick succession, and doing so would generally leave an alliance in tatters.

This was pretty common in FFXI; bosses would typically have at least one really nasty trick, and it would be randomly shuffled in with a bunch of less nasty moves. How often you got the bad one was pure chance; you might go the whole fight and never see it, or the boss might use it back to back.

The thing is, though, bosses in FFXI were reactive, not proactive. They weren't a matter of memorizing patterns, and preparing yourself for attacks that you know are coming, so much as learning what to do recover after the boss took certain actions. It's a different sort of playstyle than we're used to in FFXIV, but I don't think it's a bad one. Weathering unfortunate boss RNG of that sort was among the greatest challenge that the game had to offer.

Originally Posted by ckc22

If you did it without syncing to minimum ilvl you didn't get a real clear.... #goalposts

The thing is, sync adds an element of challenge to these fights, without making them nigh-impossible. The fact that the option exists to crank up the difficulty to max doesn't invalidate the satisfaction you get from cranking up the difficulty merely to the point where people have to actually pay attention to the fight.

You'd be hard-pressed to find someone who will claim that they gained any sort of satisfaction out of completing a fight unsynced, while plenty of folks will get a rush from doing the same content synced, but not minimum ilvl. "Why bother to make it hard for yourself, when you can make it SUPER hard for yourself?" is a very thin argument.

I understand and respect folks who want to get a taste of what the fights were like back when they were still relevant.

Originally Posted by ckc22

Doing fights with everyone synced down to what would have t.

But its still not the same thing to where you can ignore the mechanics competently, and do a fight that would take ten mins are more sometimes, and condense it into 2 or 3 mins there is a huge difference. Nobody is rage quiting unsync primals or abandoning them, people arent farming sync for the horses , they are doing that with unsync there is a major difference here. And this goes again to how you play the game maybe everyone doesnt want to rush to the very end of the game and just do their dalies , and farm the same raid again and again.

Maybe some people view this as a whole entire game not just 10 percent of a game, so Ill never be the first to clear anything simply because Id rather stretch out whats in front of me and always have things to do instead of rushing to endgame and focusing on two or three things at a time thats not fun to me.

Originally Posted by ckc22

Doing fights with everyone synced down to what would have been BIS gear isn't what it was like when it was "relevant" either. My point is that your "real clear" isn't "real" either - in the exact same way that someone clearing Thordan Ex in 260 right now for example isn't experiencing what the fight was like when it was relevant.

Believe me, my time doing Mentor Roulette has made it very clear that there's a WORLD of difference between unsynced and max ilvl. Running these fights synced adds real challenge for newer players, particularly fights like Odin (healers' hell) and Ramuh (so much coordination needed). Max ilvl isn't going to save you from a mishandled Chaotic Strike or Glass Dance (to say nothing of Landslide).

No one said anything about trying to replicate the fights back when they were fresh and new and players with last patch's gear were struggling their way through. What many players want is the opportunity to see what it was like when mechanics MATTERED. For Final Fantasy fans, especially, battles against foes like Ifrit or Shiva or Ultima Weapon should be EPIC. These are icons of the franchise. Derping your way through the fight unsynced while the primals pelt you with pitiful scratch damage is simply not comparable to running the fight synced, even if the players are at max ilvl for the fight. I don't think that it's odd at all that players would want to see what these fights were like in their heyday, even if max gear ilvl (and echo!) gives them advantages in the fight that the original players didn't have.