WHM getting progressively more unnecessary in content?

[Cynfael]

Basically everything that Rawrz just said.

To reiterate, I recommend forming your opinion based on your personal experience with healer jobs at the same level; if you judge based on how other players do, you will not get the real picture. There are simply too many players out there setting poor examples, and they are steering you wrong if you think that SCH or AST are at all lacking right now.

There are legitimate reasons why some WHM players are expressing concern over how the other two healing jobs are steadily encroaching on their niche. I don't think that WHM needs massive buffs or an overhaul, but I do think that WHM needs to be examined for tweaks in light of the fact that they are no longer the only healer that brings multiple regen effects to the table (their old niche vs. SCH's regen effect being tied to Eos) and that raw HPS is not necessary or desirable beyond what is needed to clear duties. WHM works just fine, but IMO the job has lost a little bit of what makes it unique aside from having the easiest kit.

[Exiled_Tonberry]

WHM works just fine, but IMO the job has lost a little bit of what makes it unique aside from having the easiest kit.

Exactly this. The only thing WHM actually has going for it right now in raids is being easy to handle. Which is in no way an identity to distinguish itself from the other healers, let alone stand up against them.

Basically, WHM can't just stick to only heals. It needs something else that's unique to them to even stand a chance against the other two. Either that or SE bumps WHM healing up to a borderline broken level to the point where not even a 10% 40 second damage up buff would sound appealing. And that would be just stupid.

[Yeol]

No, WHM is also missing utility. Look at everything unique the healers can do outside healing or dealing damage. AST has Disable and Cards. SCH has enhanced E4E and Virus, and Sacred Soil. WHM has... Nothing. This isn't even including fairy buffs or shields. Give me am example of something a WHM brings to a party that the others don't and I may change my opinion.

Not every job in this game must have utility.

[Cynfael]

Not every job in this game must have utility.

True, but since utility is in demand, the trade-off needs to be excellence in another area.

WHM's potential issue is that not only do we not really need more of what the job is really good at (straight-up HPS), it doesn't come with many bells and whistles compared to its peers aside from impressive AoE burst damage, which is more of a nice bonus for dungeon trash than anything else.

Just being a good healer isn't really enough to distinguish WHM anymore. I think it will continue to be perfectly functional for all content, but it would be disappointing to see it fall into its own vanilla healer ghetto now that the other two healing jobs encroach on what used to be its unique strengths. The dynamic between SCH and WHM in 2.x was more clearly defined IMO, with WHM being desirable for the ease of burst raid healing that the SCH could not provide, but with the addition of a third healing job, SE is now going with the approach that all three should be viable for all healing needs. I think that was a good idea in general, but WHM being great at healing doesn't seem to be as strong a selling point as it used to be.

[Exiled_Tonberry]

Not every job in this game must have utility.

When nearly every job in the game has utility and synergizes with other jobs, the ones that don't have it are going to stand out.
And they better have something damn good to make up for that lack of utility. And that's where WHM comes into play. It's slightly stronger healing potency doesn't make up for not having any utility.

The situation It doesn't get any better as gear gets better and content gets easier. Strictly heals is just not going to cut it when the Cure III you didn't even need at first becomes even more useless.

[Yeol]

I didn't say that slightly stronger healing potency is making up for their lack of utility.

Try going double WHM and let them decide who will be MH and see how much DPs the other one can put. You'll be amazed.
But like I said, sadly WHM cannot do both at the same time due to their tight MP. If they had better way to recover MP you'll see them spamming holy and helping with killing ads rather than focusing all the time on healing because if they do anything else they will cry for MP.

SCH and AST have no problem healing + dpsing and they have utility on top of that.
While WHM can heal but they will have trouble dpsing due to high MP cost. The least they could do is give them better way to recover MP and let them DPs since they have no utility.

[Sanghelios]

Am i the only one who things a higher mp regen for whms isnt a good idea? I always liked that whms have to "work together" with bards/mch to keep their mp up with ballad when it is required. Giving whm a higher mp regen to compete with scholar/ast mp regen isnt really great as it lowers the value of having a bard/mch and it would take away one of whms core mechanics (Maintain mp). If any, then ast, maybe even scholars mana regen should get nerfed to a lower level.

[VanilleFang]

The least they could do is give them better way to recover MP and let them DPs since they have no utility.

And then that brings you to the point I made. If they granted WHM a better way to regen MP they would still lack the utility of the other two healers. So instead of a WHM being 2/4, they become 3/4. Both other healers are 4/4.

Granted that may be a crude way of looking at it, but it kind of puts it into prospective.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

Exactly this. The only thing WHM actually has going for it right now in raids is being easy to handle. Which is in no way an identity to distinguish itself from the other healers, let alone stand up against them.

Basically, WHM can't just stick to only heals. It needs something else that's unique to them to even stand a chance against the other two. Either that or SE bumps WHM healing up to a borderline broken level to the point where not even a 10% 40 second damage up buff would sound appealing. And that would be just stupid.

Frankly, I think they need to bring down the potency of Scholar and Astro. There really isn't much they could give White Mage without changing the whole job from what it's always been: a healer specialist.

Just being a good healer isn't really enough to distinguish WHM anymore. I think it will continue to be perfectly functional for all content, but it would be disappointing to see it fall into its own vanilla healer ghetto now that the other two healing jobs encroach on what used to be its unique strengths. The dynamic between SCH and WHM in 2.x was more clearly defined IMO, with WHM being desirable for the ease of burst raid healing that the SCH could not provide, but with the addition of a third healing job, SE is now going with the approach that all three should be viable for all healing needs. I think that was a good idea in general, but WHM being great at healing doesn't seem to be as strong a selling point as it used to be.

See, this is where I wonder if that philosophy has caused more bad than good. A common complaint is how similar jobs are to one another. I think they need to redefine the unique aspects of each job, not just the role itself. At the moment, it seems the devs really want to have a few "simple" jobs. Unfortunately, they seem to stay that way even at max level. That's partly why Paladin has suffered throughout Heavensward.

[Cynfael]

Am i the only one who things a higher mp regen for whms isnt a good idea? I always liked that whms have to "work together" with bards/mch to keep their mp up with ballad when it is required. Giving whm a higher mp regen to compete with scholar/ast mp regen isnt really great as it lowers the value of having a bard/mch and it would take away one of whms core mechanics (Maintain mp). If any, then ast, maybe even scholars mana regen should get nerfed to a lower level.

I get what you're saying, but I've always been of the opinion that if you need to use Ballad outside of maybe raid progression, something has already gone wrong. Otherwise WHM can heal on fumes even if they Holy their MP down to almost nothing (by which point everything should be dead or dying).

Basically I never want to see Ballad etc. go up unless we need to recover from big mistakes. There's plenty keeping BRD and MCH relevant aside from their MP restoration, and I don't think that simply boosting WHM's MP regeneration is the answer. Mana management doesn't really work as a mechanic without special ways to expend and restore it, like how DRK has to juggle MP-restoring attacks in order to maintain Darkside and to boost specific abilities with additional MP use (Dark Arts).