Debuff class?

[Tonkra]

you really think that that list was complete? i dont think so at all. but well lets see. or do you think they removed shell, poison, bio, hp drain, shockspikes etc. as well?! a black mage not having poison spells?


NOT


oh man...

[Alerith]

you really think that that list was complete? i dont think so at all. but well lets see. or do you think they removed protect, poison, bio, hp drain etc. as well?!


NOT


oh man...

The list IS complete. They said 15 actions per class (not counting traits). If you count, they all have 15. So yes, Dia, Bio, etc. is currently not included.

So the only thing the list didn't show was traits.

[Tonkra]

The list IS complete. They said 15 actions per class (not counting traits). If you count, they all have 15. So yes, Dia, Bio, etc. is currently not included.

So the only thing the list didn't show was traits.

so as a black mage you dont have shockspikes, poison, bio, hp darin.. and as a whm you dont have shell (i only can see protect and stoneskin in the list from the descriptions), banish, dia well that sucks really for a great "reformation"

a reason more not to pay for the beta progress right now. thats a joke. 15 skills per class.

i imagine the discussion between the dev team:
"what the class has 16 skills? wtf. we talked about only implementing 15 skills for each class. ah well remove the cure skill from the conjurer so we dont violate our agreement."


is that a joke or what?

you can not make balancing according to just a stupid strict number? a mage often needs more skills than others.

[normalforce]

so as a black mage you dont have shockspikes, poison, bio, hp darin.. and as a whm you dont have shell (i only can see protect and stoneskin in the list from the descriptions), banish, dia well that sucks really for a great "reformation"

a reason more not to pay for the beta progress right now. thats a joke. 15 skills per class.

i imagine the discussion between the dev team:
"what the class has 16 skills? wtf. we talked about only implementing 15 skills for each class. ah well remove the cure skill from the conjurer so we dont violate our agreement."


is that a joke or what?

you can not make balancing according to just a stupid strict number? a mage often needs more skills than others.

To be fair,

CON Mag. 6 - Increases the defense of all party members within range of the target.

does not specify whether or not it's physical defense or magical defense. Maybe it'll be one spell that does both, or we just get both Protect and Shell. Because I do find it odd that we'd get one and not the other.

[Chrees]

To be fair,


does not specify whether or not it's physical defense or magical defense. Maybe it'll be a spell that does both, or we just get both Protect and Shell. Because I do find it odd that we'd get one and not the other.

Something I noticed after reading the action changes is that in the UI mockup for 2.0, it shows all of the players having two buffs that use the same symbols we currently have for protect (the hexagon) and shell (the 4 diamonds). Now I know that it's "subject to change," but it was only released a month ago. I just thought it was something to keep in mind. I'm still scratching my head over this.

[Lienn]

Something I noticed after reading the action changes is that in the UI mockup for 2.0, it shows all of the players having two buffs that use the same symbols we currently have for protect (the hexagon) and shell (the 4 diamonds). Now I know that it's "subject to change," but it was only released a month ago. I just thought it was something to keep in mind. I'm still scratching my head over this.

The image also has basic attacks and higher tier actions. So i believe it's already outdated.

[Viridiana]

so as a black mage you dont have shockspikes, poison, bio, hp darin.. and as a whm you dont have shell (i only can see protect and stoneskin in the list from the descriptions), banish, dia well that sucks really for a great "reformation"

a reason more not to pay for the beta progress right now. thats a joke. 15 skills per class.

i imagine the discussion between the dev team:
"what the class has 16 skills? wtf. we talked about only implementing 15 skills for each class. ah well remove the cure skill from the conjurer so we dont violate our agreement."


is that a joke or what?

you can not make balancing according to just a stupid strict number? a mage often needs more skills than others.

CNJ doesn't even "need" 15 skills. Honestly, if I were going to design it to have no more than 15, the first thing I'd do is combine Protect and Shell. Furthermore, CNJ has never had Dia or Banish (to my knowledge). THM is getting an effect that restores their HP on next cast; no way to know at present if that's supposed to be Drain or what. They're also getting Stygian Spikes (THM never had Shock Spikes, so I don't know why you lumped that with BLM). So. . . we're losing, what, Poison and Astral/Umbral damage spells? Maybe Shell? Oh no! How ever shall we live?!

[Tonkra]

CNJ doesn't even "need" 15 skills. Honestly, if I were going to design it to have no more than 15, the first thing I'd do is combine Protect and Shell. Furthermore, CNJ has never had Dia or Banish (to my knowledge). THM is getting an effect that restores their HP on next cast; no way to know at present if that's supposed to be Drain or what. They're also getting Stygian Spikes (THM never had Shock Spikes, so I don't know why you lumped that with BLM). So. . . we're losing, what, Poison and Astral/Umbral damage spells? Maybe Shell? Oh no! How ever shall we live?!

fanboy blabla. how do you call that in english? put lipstick on the pig?

as a mage i want variety of spells, utility spells that are useful in every way.
why is it better to lose most of your spells? i like to poison foes, slow them down and do damage on them as well... mage classes can chose the strategy cause of their variety of spells/utility spells. if you do not then its good for you..


i dont really think that this is a useful change... removing "cool" spells like scourge, poison etc... and just split the elemental spells to con and thaumaturge . why does a white mage have skills like wind, earth? i thought they wanted to make the differences more clear... but what they are doing know is just to remove skills out of the game, traditional skills. what 6 elements? throw water away, who needs that?. well that sucks really. seriously WHERE is the sense of that?
dont know whats that good about of making a mage very simplistic. well a black mage consists of thunder, fire, ice damage attacks... some sleep and thats it?

what a joke... on one side its no real black mage anymore because he doesnt have all elemental spells and on the other side the white mage is a mixture between white mage and black mage? what kind of logic is this?


in my opinion it would have been better:

whm/con:
- banish
- dia
- holy
- paralyze
- slow

black mage:
-scourge
- all elemental spells
- poison
-debuff spells

well what a black mage is supposed to be.



i dont know what kind of "bettering" this should be... ok they throw 90% of the spells out of the class. and splitted the remaining skills between con and thm. "well the con also should have 15 skills, so give three of the elemental black mage skills to the white mage.... water? well there is no space for water. they have yet 15 skills. remove water."


YEAH THAT makes real sense. this should be THE reformation? wew.. thanks square, thats really better than before. i always hated to chose which skill i should equip on my skill bar... now you made it much more easier for me.. so i can only chose between 3 damage spells.

the first thing I'd do is combine Protect and Shell

i would personally remove all kind of elemental skills and combine them into one... so you only have to push one button... and the skill automatically choses the right element onto the target. that would be somethin wouldnt it? and using that spell on a friendly target causes it to turn into a cure. perfect isnt it?

if I were going to design it to have no more than 15

well thank god, that you wont design any kind of rpg game ;x
play a hackn slay game, there you only have to push two buttons, maybe thats somethin for u.

*sarcasm off

you cant say "i gonna design a class that has max/minimum 15 skills.. thats not how balancing and class design is working (well for SE it does, like it seems)
but we see to what it ends up... there is no water element anymore... and a white mage has spells like wind, earth and tha "black" mage has no posion skills or something. lol'd enough.

[Lienn]

fanboy blabla. how do you call that in english? put lipstick on the pig?
(...)
YEAH THAT makes real sense. this should be THE reformation? wew.. thanks square, thats really better than before.

Agreed! This is looking terribly poor for a MMO...i'm just hope they give us time to try out 1.20 before billing us so we at least will be able to see what they are charging us for...will be a shame the patch being 11/30...

SE: "Here the 1.20...now don't forget to, after patching it, go to account management and reactivate your options or you won't be able to play it..."

Player: "mimimi..."

SE: "What? You took over 24hrs to patch itbecause the patcher sucks, the month changed and now you cannot play because your options were cancelled?

Player: "Yes..."

SE: "We apologize for any inconvenience this may cause and thank you for your understanding. Next!"

[Viridiana]

fanboy blabla. how do you call that in english? put lipstick on the pig?

as a mage i want variety of spells, utility spells that are useful in every way.
why is it better to lose most of your spells? i like to poison foes, slow them down and do damage on them as well... mage classes can chose the strategy cause of their variety of spells/utility spells. if you do not then its good for you..


i dont really think that this is a useful change... removing "cool" spells like scourge, poison etc... and just split the elemental spells to con and thaumaturge.. well that sucks really.
dont know whats that good about of making a mage very simplistic. well a black mage consists of thunder, fire, ice damage attacks... some sleep and thats it?

what a joke... on one side its no real black mage because he doesnt has all elemental spells and on the other side the white mage is a mixture between white mage and black mage? what kind of logic is this?


in my opinion it would have been better:

whm/con:
- banish
- dia
- holy
- paralyze
- slow

black mage:
-scourge
- all elemental spells
- poison
-debuff spells

well what a black mage is supposed to be.



i dont know what kind of "bettering" this should be... ok they throw 90% of the spells out of the class. and splitted the remaining skills between con and thm. "well the con also should have 15 skills, so give three of the elemental black mage skills to the white mage.... water? well there is no space for water. they have yet 15 skills. remove water."


YEAH THAT makes real sense. this should be THE reformation? wew.. thanks square, thats really better than before.

You may *want* a variety of spells, but how many do you actually *need*? No more than 15, I'd say. . .

Also, CNJ (the class) is not WHM (the job). That's why CNJ has elemental spells: they need something to level with. Granted, I'd have given them Banish and Scourge instead, because that would lead to less RDM rage. As far as your comment about "Waaa. . . BLM doesn't have all the elements! Waaa!" Wind was a WHM spell before it was a BLM spell, anyway, and very few incarnations of BLM had every element, anyway.