The New Chat Restriction in The Feast

[ThirdChild_ZKI]

What better time to offer advice than right after? Let time pass and perhaps that person won't even remember what happened. Or worse, lose another match for themselves and their team for lack of knowing. But really, we assume too much. Fact is, they were offered advice and rather than take it, or even ignore it, they chose instead to be petty and report it as harrassment. Who was really being "toxic" there? Again, neither one of us can say without knowing what exactly was said, but the fact remains that that wouldn't even be necessary were it not for this "fix" creating more problems than it solved.

[Mofafafa]

I mean, its clearly the "tank" that i spoke of isn't understanding that what was the losing condition that he could've won the game if he understand whats happening in the first place, this wouldn't be happened...

We as the players got punished for SE decision to implement the Chat Restriction. If there isn't any discussion going on and giving feedbacks based on the match's performance, how are the community is going to improve??
Now we are back to square one where the *PLAYERS* who deemed the PvP toxic because they do not want to accept feedbacks based on their lackluster performance because they simply do not accept criticism, same goes for PvE
Harassment is another case.

Usually every game will have discussion going on when win or lose and giving feedbacks to each other to improve, some player even records the whole game to check what went wrong or could've done better...

Just because the "player" is sensitive, it does not simply give him a reason to ruin the other 3 party members experience because of him not accepting criticism to improve the quality of game-play in a game.

[RiyahArp]

You don't criticize someone right after the match in an intrusive /tell, especially if you don't know them. If you were an actual team, you'd hit the showers first and let the athletes get over the emotional impact of loss, then you meet up and get out the whiteboards and show the game and what happened, and then work together analyzing mistakes. But you aren't that guys coach, nor do you have the right really to do this; you're just some random guy suddenly /telling them after the match from afar, and someone who really doesn't have the same connection. So if you try to do this, its adversarial from the start because you haven't really built that team connection. And people don't often act polite if they do that; the anger at a loss through no fault of your own is pretty strong, and can color how you try to "help" the person.

This is also behin the same fear people have with parsers. You can't just be random internetguy and intrude via tell to criticize from a position of authority, even if you werent the one who screwed up. You need that team relationship first, so that the person isn't on edge from the intrusion and also isn't dealing with your anger at him losing the game for you. It's just really bad to try and /tell someone and immediately assume that authority of coach when you've never even seen the guy before or talked to him in game, especially when it has to do with performance issues. But if you invite him into a pvp linkshell and make him part of the team in a sense, it works much better for everyone. Power dynamics can screw stuff up pretty badly, and this is just even if you try to be polite; I was reamed out personally in a tell after by someone with no real basis than losing as a healer (against rum raisin of all people, it was that early in the feast)

[ThirdChild_ZKI]

No Riyah.

First, you have the mistaken impression that it's criticism when sometimes it's really just passing along helpful advice.

"Hey man, when we're ahead like that and time's running out, it's better if we pull back and ride it out rather than take the risk."
"Make sure you won't be picking up too many medals before grabbing them next time. If so, let someone else get them."
"Hey, next time let's try to go after the same target together. We might be able to get them before their healer can react."

Nothing toxic at all in those words, and things I've actually said to others before, right after a match. As I said before, most times it's better to reflect and breakdown what happened right away while it's still fresh to remember. Sure, sometimes you might need to calm down first, but any athlete worth something will be receptive to advice, even after a win.

[jameseoakes]

Nothing toxic at all in those words, and things I've actually said to others before, right after a match. As I said before, most times it's better to reflect and breakdown what happened right away while it's still fresh to remember. Sure, sometimes you might need to calm down first, but any athlete worth something will be receptive to advice, even after a win.

We're not Athletes though Thunder, we're people playing a game and in my experience of the chat with randoms people didn't really give advice once the game was over they just insulted you if they didn't think you should be playing

[AriaFairchild]

A friend of mine got banned recently for

1) his party's tank died at last 5s for not following the *Quick Chat* fall back call outs.
2) friend proceed to send TELL to him
3) Explain him what went wrong and why they lost
4) the Tank perceive my friend that he is harassing the tanks
5) Proceed to report my friend,
6) friend got banned.


Hello SE, if only chat was still there and actually have the ability to communicate the call outs detail on the winning conditions.

This generation of snowflakes...

[ThirdChild_ZKI]

We're not Athletes though Thunder, we're people playing a game and in my experience of the chat with randoms people didn't really give advice once the game was over they just insulted you if they didn't think you should be playing

I approach this game with the mindset of an athlete, rather, I approach competition in that manner. If I'm going to do something, I want to do it well. I won't always do it well, but I will try. That's all you can ask of someone. Now, if someone gives advice - and mind you, I've given plenty based on experience and still been told I'm wrong - it may be worth listening if it's constructive. At a certain point, you've got to stop wearing your feelings on your sleeve or thinking they're all out to get you and listen and wisen up. Opponents who want to win as bad as you do are not going to pull any punches, and not every person you meet in your adventures is going to have something nice to say. If you're ready to cry wolf and refuse to listen when people are actually being nice and helpful, you're in for a real bad time when they won't be.

Mind you, this is no excuse for nasty tells or rude behavior. I've stated this. We can share all the annecdotal experiences we want. For every person that got a nasty tell, I've gotten a heartfelt thank you, or answered questions and given or received advice from some of the top players on my data center, and imparted that same knowledge to others. The PvP community was too small to be trying to force people out or burn bridges. HOWEVER, I can't pretend I didn't see the same issues there that I've seen in PvE content: People either refuse to, or don't care to learn, and everyone has a poorer experience for it.

With nothing but the facts presented, we're left with this: The tank didn't listen when told - via Quick Chat - to fall back, and his team suffered a loss for it. That person took the time to explain what happened and why they lost, and rather than listen OR ask any questions if unsure, they took it as a personal attack, and retaliated. If it were SE's plan to create a competitive environment where everyone is forced into silence lest even the kindest word be taken out of context (irony considering the most sarcastically spammed QC phrase) we'd have a much, MUCH bigger problem than players being nasty toward one another. Because if players can't share and help each other, those who know will continue to win, and those who don't will lose repeatedly, until perhaps they somehow figure it out. And when those two are put on the same team, one will certainly be more of a liability to the other. And I've said it before: I don't know anyone who enjoys losing a game, especially due to the actions of others.

[RiyahArp]

I don't know. I just explained why someone might get mad enough to report or blacklist someone, and a little on the psychology of giving criticism to strangers. Up to you if you want to handwave it away by saying "special snowflake" or "Well, I do this so its good for them to do it too" have fun. I mean, its rare in either case, most would just blacklist you if you annoyed them or they were on edge anyways, or just brush you off. You can argue "this is how people should be," but they often aren't.

[ThirdChild_ZKI]

If anything, you're simply handwaving any other viewpoint that doesn't suit your narrative.

Consider that this can go two ways from here:

A. That tank is going to be an easy target for others who actually WILL say something negative due to his throwing matches and not even knowing what he's doing wrong.
B. That tank may possibly reflect on what was said and perhaps remember that next time his team is calling to "Fall back!"

If he doesn't want to listen and just believe everyone's so toxic and out to get him, A is very likely going to happen. But if he perhaps stops for a moment and reflects properly on the match (as opposed to shrugging it off and just jumping into another), B will happen, and it will be a greater benefit to him and his future teammates.

This is competition. There is no safe space where your feelings matter above all others. Even the best players lose. The difference between that tank and the best players is that they were willing to listen and learn. Some ask questions. Some accept advice or criticisms. . . and some learn the hard way. It doesn't matter how they learn, so long as they do.

[Mofafafa]

Let's get back to the chat restriction downside,

Another friend of mine in which is one of the top healer in JP, he is quite famous "for what i know" from western pvp discord specificly for "The Feast" got issued his very first warning regarding quick chat *spamming*

The *spamming* for abusing quick chat can be reported and recognized for the GM to issue a ticket for the player that press the same button for more than 3 times.

This friend of mine, got teleported to the jail *LIVE ON STREAM* and when he asked what's wrong to the GM, the GM responded, you were reported for flooding the chat by spamming quick chat which is *Fall Back!*
So, if only there wasn't a chat restriction, he wouldn't be getting his first warning as he could be typing

*fall back* isn't really a passive aggressive word such as *Nice job* * Good Game*

but he still got reported because of him simply trying to win the game, getting caught up into the adrenaline of the game.

So i must say, the players once again got punished for the chat restrictions.

Like for real tho, communication such an important factor in competitive situation. Quick chat is certainly improving time over time but it will never replace the full chat functionality, and quick chat button is contradicting SE very own 9 button purposes gameplay.