The New Chat Restriction in The Feast

[ThirdChild_ZKI]

For perspective: we are now at 23 pages, predominantly full of "remove quick chat/restore normal chat" after Luxpheras called for suggestions.

It's long overdue now to have this matter addressed properly. The quick chat has proven itself to be far more of a problem than a solution. If this is not corrected before Season 4, I don't see very many people being motivated to participate.

[TiramisuMacaron]

After playing a lot of matches without chat. Losses are more frustrating because I feel as if most of them could be prevented through good chat. Wins are less rewarding because after an intense match I have nobody to talk to it about, unless people on my team were on myself server. Feast is way less fun now if you don't stream or use VoIP

[Headhunters]

for sure ill not be playing season 4 if chat is still unavailable. lots of shit players with no clues trying to run ranked pvp

[Kai_Lee]

I understand no chat is bad, but how you expect them to learn if they dont play? Thats like expecting players to beat savage or ex primals by simply watching a video but never step foot into the actual content. Plus calling them out only reinforce SE decision to ban chat.

[ThirdChild_ZKI]

I understand no chat is bad, but how you expect them to learn if they dont play? Thats like expecting players to beat savage or ex primals by simply watching a video but never step foot into the actual content. Plus calling them out only reinforce SE decision to ban chat.

This is incorrect, and we've already pointed out reasons why:

- If someone shows up wearing gear below i150, you can't tell them they would need at least i150 or higher.
- If a tank is at 4 stacks of medals, you can't tell them they need to start letting other teammates get them.
- If they are a BRD, MNK, or MCH and do not know those jobs' very powerful burst rotations - rotations capable of changing a match drastically - you can't even teach them on the fly.
- If someone is new, they can't actively ask any questions about what they don't know, and you can't teach them.


There are many more reasons why, but fact is, the quick chat causes far more problems than it solves.

[loreleidiangelo]

I understand no chat is bad, but how you expect them to learn if they dont play? Thats like expecting players to beat savage or ex primals by simply watching a video but never step foot into the actual content. Plus calling them out only reinforce SE decision to ban chat.

To be fair, I reasonably expect them to derp around in Frontlines and unranked first, before queuing directly into ranked. I also, pre chat-ban, would have expected them to admit that they were new at the start, state their level of experience with previous PVP modes, and ask for tips, pointers, and advice, and apologize in advance for any screw-ups. This type of behavior would HARDLY prompt a hostile response from players (at least it sure didn't when I was new to Frontlines all the way back during my noob days of Secure), and if it did, the newbie in question would without a doubt be right in pursuing a harassment report over it. I don't think anyone here is disputing that.

The problem is, I don't feel like this is what was happening. I feel like players felt entitled to queue into a team competitive mode, 100% clueless, run around aimlessly feeding kills and then have the gall to get upset when other players chewed them out over it. I feel like they perceived rudeness - while not ideal - as harassment, and swore off the entire PVP community as a pile of festering pustules when in reality they didn't bother to see how their careless actions influenced others. I feel like a lot of them coast by with mediocrity in PVE and feel like that cavalier attitude is acceptable for PVP, when in fact they're two entirely different types of play with VASTLY different skill requirements and much stricter penalties for failure.

This might be seen as harsh, I don't know. Maybe someone will read this and get the impression that I'm the biggest jerk there is, and that I only view my Feast teammates as a means to an end, a ball and chain, and anchor around my neck if they're bad, or whatever sort of unflattering label they want to imagine I apply to others. But the truth is, I don't. I respect effort, I respect inquisition. I respect players who respect players, first and foremost, and that INCLUDES not feeling entitled to stroll into a ranked match fresh off the turnip truck to Ishgard and happily tank a group's rating because "hey man I'm learning, you don't pay my sub". I'd much rather lose with an earnest newbie who walks away determined to correct their mistakes and do better next time than win by carrying a total deadweight who hopes to skate by off the effort of others.

I mean, even FRONTLINES helps you get acquainted with your PVP skills, burst damage (healing in PVP is WAY different than healing in PVE), situational awareness, etc. I don't understand why people even now feel the need to just jump right into ranked with players who have done other modes of PVP gameplay, learned from it, and are actively trying to climb the ladder. It's flagrantly disrespectful. And now this chat ban sucks, because I don't know WHO is new but actually trying their best, and who just plain sucks but felt entitled to waste 3 other peoples' time. For what it's worth, I probably wouldn't flame the second sort of player either way (I'm pretty non-confrontational outside of the forums, haha), but I can completely understand players who would lash out at that type of player out of frustration.

[ThirdChild_ZKI]

Thank you. I don't think anyone has said this better. And I truly hope that players who might still perhaps support the idea of a chat ban on the premise of it being a perfect solution for harrassment really take note of this and reconsider things.

[Ama_Hamada]

To be fair, I reasonably expect them to derp around in Frontlines and unranked first, before queuing directly into ranked. I also, pre chat-ban, would have expected them to admit that they were new at the start, state their level of experience with previous PVP modes, and ask for tips, pointers, and advice, and apologize in advance for any screw-ups. This type of behavior would HARDLY prompt a hostile response from players (at least it sure didn't when I was new to Frontlines all the way back during my noob days of Secure), and if it did, the newbie in question would without a doubt be right in pursuing a harassment report over it. I don't think anyone here is disputing that.
The problem is, I don't feel like this is what was happening. I feel like players felt entitled to queue into a team competitive mode, 100% clueless, run around aimlessly feeding kills and then have the gall to get upset when other players chewed them out over it. I feel like they perceived rudeness - while not ideal - as harassment, and swore off the entire PVP community as a pile of festering pustules when in reality they didn't bother to see how their careless actions influenced others. I feel like a lot of them coast by with mediocrity in PVE and feel like that cavalier attitude is acceptable for PVP, when in fact they're two entirely different types of play with VASTLY different skill requirements and much stricter penalties for failure.

This might be seen as harsh, I don't know. Maybe someone will read this and get the impression that I'm the biggest jerk there is, and that I only view my Feast teammates as a means to an end, a ball and chain, and anchor around my neck if they're bad, or whatever sort of unflattering label they want to imagine I apply to others. But the truth is, I don't. I respect effort, I respect inquisition. I respect players who respect players, first and foremost, and that INCLUDES not feeling entitled to stroll into a ranked match fresh off the turnip truck to Ishgard and happily tank a group's rating because "hey man I'm learning, you don't pay my sub". I'd much rather lose with an earnest newbie who walks away determined to correct their mistakes and do better next time than win by carrying a total deadweight who hopes to skate by off the effort of others.

I mean, even FRONTLINES helps you get acquainted with your PVP skills, burst damage (healing in PVP is WAY different than healing in PVE), situational awareness, etc. I don't understand why people even now feel the need to just jump right into ranked with players who have done other modes of PVP gameplay, learned from it, and are actively trying to climb the ladder. It's flagrantly disrespectful. And now this chat ban sucks, because I don't know WHO is new but actually trying their best, and who just plain sucks but felt entitled to waste 3 other peoples' time. For what it's worth, I probably wouldn't flame the second sort of player either way (I'm pretty non-confrontational outside of the forums, haha), but I can completely understand players who would lash out at that type of player out of frustration.

It is no different then PvE. The people that post along the lines of "this game is the least toxic of any mno I seen. People help me and give advice" are the one that accept the advice. So they do not see what an experienced player gets, rather it be in PvE or PvP when the new person is toxic and argumentative. I kid you not in front lines I saw a new player run into a group of 10 or so players of the other team and died near intensely. So it was said "hey do not run in a large group like that" only to get a reply of "I am new don't be a cuck"

Was was too long ago in Dun Scaith like 5 days? where a new person was there dying repeatedly at the first boss and said "I am new any tips?" My answer was, should told us sooner. Split second later when you get that ice drop part i said run away then get behind the ice, of course he died. Then again I said "it would of helped if you told us sooner because it is hard to explain the fight while healing. " he started to chew me out this point and the pt got on his back because 1. I was the only one offering advice or trying too plus someone felt you shouldn't make your healers mad. I was semi-carrying as well, though healing like trying to raise the healers in the other parties, so that makes trying to explain the fights increasingly difficult and no one else was attempting. Something like this also happened on v2 where a new pld wiped the whole alliance for not stating being new, not admitting it, letting our pt die to the black hole phase from just standing there doing nothing, home pointing after that, then chewed me out when I said you should admit being new sooner and you shouldn't of HP. kick passed both times, and these are just recent examples, it is very common thing.

You are simply telling you like it is, if anyone gets offended it is likely because they act in the same way. I am really getting tried of self entitled toxic new players who can't take an once of advice and criticism and that think 7 or 23 people need to bow down to them.

[Llus]

I understand no chat is bad, but how you expect them to learn if they dont play? Thats like expecting players to beat savage or ex primals by simply watching a video but never step foot into the actual content. Plus calling them out only reinforce SE decision to ban chat.

Yet the expectation for even savage and ex primals is that you'll have watched the video and that you'll know what to do. Also PvP is VERY different from PvE as this is not a scripted encounter and you need to know a lot about PvP before you try ranked. That'd be like expecting someone who's never even run a simple dungeon to beat A12S

[KfLeX]

They already found ways, by annoying you with emotes if you do bad in matches.