The Journey - Is It Still Wanted?

[Estellios]

Nullie brought up something that I forgot, myself.

Personally I feel like every major update to the game is a milestone, it's created lots of memories of both the good and bad and it's cool seeing all these changes =P

[Allistar]

Hi All,

With the lively discussion in a recent PL thread, the topic of the Journey was brought up. Seeing the diverse opinions on the subject, I'm curious:

• Do people still care for the Journey from Level 1 to Max? Specifically the dreaded "G" word, known as the Grind?

We know Final Fantasy XIV Version 2.0 is promising a wonderful reboot and a complete World Redesign (joy!). But even then, will Yoshida-san keep the super fast speed and pace of leveling as it is now? And if so, will people even get to enjoy most of the new areas before they're at Max Level doing End Game-only content?

While I agree that killing your 2,000th Raptor isn't going to teach you how to beat an End Game Boss, there is something to be said about the Journey to get from Level 1 to 50.

During Final Fantasy XI (in the early days), some of my fondest memories were of things like...



Traveling to Valkurm Dunes for the first time. Seeing all these strangers and fellow low level players braving the beaches and trying to get a high enough level to progress further. Running back into the coastal town with accidental links to prevent dying. LOL Or Shouting for a Raise for a dead party member and finding a friendly high level White Mage who helped us out. Or someone accidentally pulling Valkurm Emperor thinking it was another dragonfly (back in the early days .



Getting to Jeuno, and then exploring the zone underneath known as Qufim Island was another memorable experience during my grind. I remember scared warnings from fellow adventurers to retreat when it got dark (night), because Qufim Island at night turned into a completely different horrific environment compared to daytime (for low level players). But it was fun, being scared and staying huddled, waiting for the sun to come back up.



Or wandering Rolanberry Fields, a scenic detour near Jeuno and meeting all sorts of strangers there on their way to Crawler's Nest...



Which was a pretty crowded, popular area to camp those giant Crawlers. Sure there was fighting over mob spawns, but it was also filled with nervous, fun memories of overcoming and pulling Crawlers across long portions back to your camp, like bringing a prized kill back to your family (party) to enjoy (EXP off of).



Gustav Tunnel was another memorable place I had some fun EXP Parties at. I remember the first time I ran around a corner to come face-to-face with this big Wyvern-like NM, Bune! :O I was so freaked out and it proceeded to destroy my entire EXP Party, LOL.



Pashhow Marshlands was another interesting area filled with Quadavs (Beastmen) and a visually distinct environment to party in.



And of course, wandering into Beadeaux and finding Quadav NMs was always interesting.



Running into Castle Oztroja, and fighting Yagudo (Bird Beastmen) was another fun time sink, and memories of Mee Deggi The Punisher are forever burned in my brain.



Kazham and the 2 Jungles and the Tonberry Temple were other very memorable EXP Places that I met and discovered new friends while on the grind.



And places like The Boyahda Tree, and someone accidentally pulling Aquarius NM (thinking it was a regular crab) was hilarious thinking back on it now.

The pace of the original Grind from Level 1 to 75 in Final Fantasy XI was definitely too long in this day-and-age, but I had many good memories as I made my way to my first Level 75 job back then.

I learned about Skillchains and helped teach fellow players how to Skillchain. We learned our abilities and weaponskills, how to handle multiple (accidental) aggro, built up confidence, and just generally grinded (true). But I had fun.

The new Final Fantasy XIV Version 2.0 World Redesign is truly AMAZING! (If you haven't seen the PDF with images, do so now! -

Final Fantasy XIV Version 2.0 World Map Art (thanks Starlord!)
http://aniverse.net/attachment.php?a...3&d=1318757548

http://aniverse.net/attachment.php?a...4&d=1318757561

http://aniverse.net/attachment.php?a...5&d=1318757639

http://aniverse.net/attachment.php?a...6&d=1318757654

http://wdl.square-enix.com/ffxiv/download/en/FFXIV_2.0_Specs_EN.pdf

Will people still want to spend time EXP'ing in these areas given the feelings on the boards about how good the super-fast pace of EXP is right now?

All I know is, I can't wait for new classes to open up for an opportunity to take a new Level 1 class through and explore all the new world areas in Final Fantasy XIV Version 2.0. (^_^)

Don't get me wrong, I want a complex, well-developed pantheon of End Game Content (many choices for many people (Instanced Dungeons, Non-Instanced Dungeons, HNMs, Large Scale PvE Areas, our own XIV version of SKY or SEA or Dynamis (original days)), but I'd love to just adventure and explore the new, distinct world in 2.0 with fellow adventurers.

How does everyone else feel?

I still want the journey...everything you stated IMO is what an MMO should be about...wonder...amazement...awe...inspiring...fearful...and FUN!!!

[Issac]

Journey is need and definitely the best part of any kind of RPG. It may be "2011" but that's no excuse to ignore the whole reason MUDs and MMOs were created in the first place.

Sweet and succinct. Thank you. +1

[Jynx]

Personally the journey is the biggest reason I play MMO's and I do hope FFXIV has a decent journey when 2.0 arrives. the current

Can't walk anywhere, can't fight anything, can't risk anything because it wastes my precious time mentality needs to go.

[AlexNiculaie]

I can certainly see slowing down leveling somewhat, a few weeks to get to 50 from 1, rather than a day or two, but not the asinine grind that was in FFXI. Dear god that was just plain idiocy. How anyone could long for that is beyond me.

[Issac]

By the way Kiara, words cannot express how grateful I am that you took the time to inspire nostalgia into me and countless others tonight.

So alarmingly true, an experience that I miss dearly as no MMO has even come close to what FFXI was for me. I hate to bring this up, well, who am I kidding. I love to use this point because of how true it rings to me: Ever since WoW came along, the MMO genre (If you can even still call it that,) has gone downhill. In my opinion. Weigh it as you wish.

[JGwinters]

Thanks for creating this thread. Today I sorely needed a reminder that there are people to whom the journey matters.

[Altanas]

I wholly favour the Journey, but I dont feel it eminates from the Grind at all.



I liked the traditional xp party, but hated the fact you just camped in one spot the whole time. I spent 10 hours in Boyada Tree in one camp /groan, and didnt learn much about my job as it became a brainless exercise.

I dont feel part of the world in a grind party camp, I feel like I'm doing nothing to the world just killing the same crab over and over. I much prefer objective based parties like Assaults (as opposed to Guildleves style objectives) and roaming parties (overworld or dungeons) as these mix tactics up so it doesnt become a snoozefest.

There is a clear reason why grind parties should not be centre stage - because most grind parties dont bother with half the zones mentioned in the OP.

I'd agree that partying is pretty much how to meet new people though, but the most cherished memories comes from adventuring with those new friends while trying to do a quest or mission (i.e. a non grindy activity) - that is the Journey. 14 lacks this Journey.



Ironically, places like Temple of Uggalepih are cherished not because of any xp parties, but because they were visited so rarely and even then just for unique quests or missions.

I'd also say that in 11 yes we have cherished memories from going to Dunes or Qufim, but I would say the best memories in 11 actually come from the frustration of failing the Missions so much you have to keep doing them every evening to clear them. You log on each time and see at least the same people wanting to try again and again.

I would say it was the sheer difficulty of the Missions that taught people how to play their jobs rather than the grind parties. If you knew your job through xp parties then surely you would have passed the Mission first time no? This comes round in circles and asks what is the point of the Grind.

There might be this one Tarutaru who wants to sub WAR on his BLM and you all /sigh. You might part ways but at a later Mission you'l cross paths again, and then a year or two later when you walk around Sea and see that same Tarutaru BLM friend now perfectly soloing sharks it makes you smile. Then another year or two later the same Tarutaru twaddles into Walk of Echoes showing off his new Shiny Spell only to get smacked for over 9000 damage, again makes you smile and together you laugh it off.

To draw from this though, the Missions in 11 were all end-game in a sense and it was from all these perfectly placed end game points that you learnt your role.

The Promyvion missions at 30 were an end game to the level 30 characters. You explored Promyvion with your level 30 group going up several floors to a boss. It was the first time you would have been in a roaming party and told to stop because the WHM had to rest (something you didnt realise in all those levels before).

In later years, Sky, Sea, Walk of Echoes et al became endgame events and you learn your role through exposure to differing strategy, not through brainless snoozefests whacking on a defenceless crab.

What, I would say, 14 needs, for the community to grow and to experience the Journey, are those group orientated missions with zones locked away until they are completed.


This thread really raises a number of issues

1.Journey - the memories - 14 doesnt have this because of its lack of forced group content/missions. There is no place in 14 that compares to say Temple of Uggalepih from 11 - i.e. there is no place that we must go to with at least one other person. Or lets put it in a stronger way --> there is no place that anyone dare go to without at least one other person. There is no place as frightening as Castle Zvahl that it has you on the edge of your seat at level 50.

2.Grind - Granted we need some Grind in an MMO - but can we move on from "xp parties" in 11's sense of standing still killing the same crab as it spawns again and again.

3.Learning your role - Can you do it through Grind or Can you do once your at your "end game" point. I would have to say as 11's community matured, the newer players learnt at endgame. This is because the veterans led the xp parties and ensured there were no accidental links. A newer player could get to 75 with perfect parties, but then have never learnt about coping with links until doing endgame.


Just for clarity, my best friends in 11, with the exception of one, were players that i NEVER met in a grind party - i met them in other ways all in game.

[Estellios]

^^ This guy gets it, this is why stuff is memorable for me.

[Kiara]

Personally the journey is the biggest reason I play MMO's and I do hope FFXIV has a decent journey when 2.0 arrives. the current

Can't walk anywhere, can't fight anything, can't risk anything because it wastes my precious time mentality needs to go.

Hi Jynx,

Good to know you and others here still enjoy the Journey. I really can't wait for 2.0's new world design.