The Journey - Is It Still Wanted?

[Blain]

Manly tears were shed at OP. We need the fear and the sense progression back ^_^ I have faith that 2.0 will bring that and more!

[Hanemakikaze]

Stop playing mmorpg. People like you are killing ffxiv.

Lol Please explain how I'm "killing" this game when I support it? Please explain how me not liking XI after playing that bs for 5 years is killing this game? Go on, please explain to me how me not liking wanting to party after I get off work instead of waiting around being forced to either do something else or not play has anything to do with killing FFXIV? You could also explain to me how not wanting to wait 5+ months to receive 1 item from an easy to kill HNM due to all the botting LSs is killing FFXIV. Please, before you run your mouth you should probably ask why I think the way I do.

And everyone say MMO is not for me? Give me a break, because I have a different opinion of your beloved XI I need to stop playing mmos? This forum is just full of lols lately. You know what I want? I want progress, not a step back in the same direction, you people need to chill out & realize the majority doesn't want the same old grind fest. And people claiming XI took strategy in exp parties before Aht Urghan? Pull > Debuff> skillchain > kill. Yeah, some strategy there. You know the difference after that expansion? Pull > WS> Kill > faster exp, everyones happy.

[elreed]

Lol Please explain how I'm "killing" this game when I support it? Please explain how me not liking XI after playing that bs for 5 years is killing this game? Go on, please explain to me how me not liking wanting to party after I get off work instead of waiting around being forced to either do something else or not play has anything to do with killing FFXIV? You could also explain to me how not wanting to wait 5+ months to receive 1 item from an easy to kill HNM due to all the botting LSs is killing FFXIV. Please, before you run your mouth you should probably ask why I think the way I do.

And everyone say MMO is not for me? Give me a break, because I have a different opinion of your beloved XI I need to stop playing mmos? This forum is just full of lols lately. You know what I want? I want progress, not a step back in the same direction, you people need to chill out & realize the majority doesn't want the same old grind fest. And people claiming XI took strategy in exp parties before Aht Urghan? Pull > Debuff> skillchain > kill. Yeah, some strategy there. You know the difference after that expansion? Pull > WS> Kill > faster exp, everyones happy.

you're right in one thing, people doesnt want to grind all the time to get to a certain level, but what i wouldnt like is to have an easy mode to get stuff, not in a way were you get bs drop rate but in a way that you need to make an effort, many people says that WoW is still alive and all but the thing that killed that game for me was how they made the items drop system, as a normal MMO you had some rare and difficult items but you had too pseudo best pieces of gear, so even casuals got bored quickly, because even that they didnt played the game that much they had all in a few days because of the trade seal for gear system, so all items became obsolete every 2-4 months.

In the opposite side was XI where in order to get something decent you had to invest a lot of time even leave things from RL because you had to be for an NM killing at 3am, and if you missed it you had to wait 36 hrs, so in a few words i want something in between where you have to work your way trough but not that much to be impossible for the majority, im a casual semi hardcore player so i know when people says that they dont have that much time to invest to the game and want to be rewarded, i want items to last longer like 1 year or every expansion and even with an expansion those items are still very useful, so at the end everyone is happy because people have something to focus and are rewarded according to they efforts.

[Jynx]

I never felt accomplished in that game, it was more like "god finally I'm done with this bs, now for the boring merit parties ugh" or "finally after months I got this 1 drop, so ridiculous".

It sounds like something was keeping you in the game despite your utter hatred for it...funny.

To be more on point MMOs are not "Better" going the easy route or the hard route, it's a matter of opinion (OMG I know right?) wether the game direction suits your tastes or not. Calling people masochists just because they don't feel like leveling to 50 in a single day is rewarding is...well idiotic.

There are two main splinters in the MMO market.

On one hand you have players who want leveling and the world to be alive and vivid, they want leveling your character to feel as a extremly important step in the game if not a extremly large portion of the game. With multiple ways to strengthen your character vertically and horizontally, they want content that spreads over the new-max level ranges and gives everyone equal oportunity to play, and have something to do despite your level.

On the other hand you have people who feel leveling shoudl fall to the wayside and progression should be made entirely through gear obtained from the end-game enviroment, they don't care how they get to max rank and perhaps wish leveling didn't exist at all. They tend to revolve around a instant gratification scheme where content is quick and easy to get into and complete.

I may be a bit schewed in my comparison, but people who tend to find any time consuming content to be "Boring, useless..." tend to not want to spend time accomplishing well....anything. How the former model works in the long run is beyond me, I can only imagine it be sustained by constantly pushing the boundries of the game (Level cap increases, obsoleting armour every few weeks) hell WoW the game that heralded this style is seemingly buckling under itself due to this odd developement cycle.

It's a matter of opinion, to call someone stupid or masochistic because they don't align with your tastes is just....asanine.

Obviously I'm in the catagory of wanting to spend time earning my achievments and progression, I find it funny that I don't have much time to dedicate to the game yet I still favour this style of progression. You would be amazed at how many people try to point out I have too much free time if I decide that I want to have the game last me for years and have a long leveling curve.

[Crunkjuice]

what journey. if you call spaming leves and grinding in exp pt so many hours a day till you cap lvl then no i don't want that journey. this game lacks to much content to have a journey. just pointless grinds they seem to remove every other patch. at rate they adding content i would have to stop playing for 2 years to enjoy a journey. thread is pointless by time the real game gets here anyone reading this will have multiple 50s and skiped any "journey"

[Hanemakikaze]

It sounds like something was keeping you in the game despite your utter hatred for it...funny.

To be more on point MMOs are not "Better" going the easy route or the hard route, it's a matter of opinion (OMG I know right?) wether the game direction suits your tastes or not. Calling people masochists just because they don't feel like leveling to 50 in a single day is rewarding is...well idiotic.

There are two main splinters in the MMO market.

On one hand you have players who want leveling and the world to be alive and vivid, they want leveling your character to feel as a extremly important step in the game if not a extremly large portion of the game. With multiple ways to strengthen your character vertically and horizontally, they want content that spreads over the new-max level ranges and gives everyone equal oportunity to play, and have something to do despite your level.

On the other hand you have people who feel leveling shoudl fall to the wayside and progression should be made entirely through gear obtained from the end-game enviroment, they don't care how they get to max rank and perhaps wish leveling didn't exist at all. They tend to revolve around a instant gratification scheme where content is quick and easy to get into and complete.

I may be a bit schewed in my comparison, but people who tend to find any time consuming content to be "Boring, useless..." tend to not want to spend time accomplishing well....anything. How the former model works in the long run is beyond me, I can only imagine it be sustained by constantly pushing the boundries of the game (Level cap increases, obsoleting armour every few weeks) hell WoW the game that heralded this style is seemingly buckling under itself due to this odd developement cycle.

It's a matter of opinion, to call someone stupid or masochistic because they don't align with your tastes is just....asanine.

Obviously I'm in the catagory of wanting to spend time earning my achievments and progression, I find it funny that I don't have much time to dedicate to the game yet I still favour this style of progression. You would be amazed at how many people try to point out I have too much free time if I decide that I want to have the game last me for years and have a long leveling curve.

Something kept me there even for my hatred for it? Yeah my friends, had nothing to do with the game being enjoyable, that was the one savior of the game for me was my LS and only reason I played for so long, they were and still are fun people to be around. And yes, I think people wanting to waste hours to get 1 level at around level 25 are masochists, like you said it's my opinion. Do I think you have to much time on your hands? No, you're free to do as you please I don't care how anyone spends it. The way I see leveling is the longer you stay lower the longer it takes to reach the actual fun content where you're not just grinding the same mob repeatedly for hours, waiting for hours to get a full group formed or invited to one.

Sure, the first time through on your first class is fine & all but on the next it just becomes an even more tedious task though fun at times. Kind of why I somewhat favor PL. But I'm talking about FFXIV, XI on the other hand...I remember trying to level my dragoon, that almost made me quit many times. Was damn near impossible to get an invite & forming a party for it was no cake walk either. If people played XI in the earlier days like they claimed to, they know exactly what I'm talking about. I remember literally having to wait days to get into a party and even if they were complete trash I took it because I had no choice. Bottom line is, let's not go back in that direction I like where Yoshi is headed the way exp & parties are currently and his current stance on PL.

[Frein]

And people claiming XI took strategy in exp parties before Aht Urghan? Pull > Debuff> skillchain > kill. Yeah, some strategy there. You know the difference after that expansion? Pull > WS> Kill > faster exp, everyones happy.

Let's try this again, shall we?

Pre ToAU
Group composition: Tank, healer, 4x support/damage (one is also puller)
The action chain we get is: Pull > Manage mob positioning > Manage hate > Coordinate WS for SC and MB
If we add a THF or /THF we also add the action of Manage player positioning.

Post ToAU
Group composition: 1x healer/support hybrid, 5x support/damage (one is also puller, black mages not allowed)
The action chain we get is: Pull > Spam WS with impunity
There is zero need for any kind of coordination. You don't even have to pay attention to what the rest of the group is doing.

Fast exp is nice when it's a reward for excellence. When it's just given to you on a silver platter because the game is designed that way, you may as well eliminate the leveling process entirely, which is exactly what you seem to want. So, why exactly do you torture yourself by playing MMORPGs?

[Jynx]

The way I see leveling is the longer you stay lower the longer it takes to reach the actual fun content

This is where your opinion and mine differ then.

I always had tons of stuff do do in XI regardless of my level, and I had tons of fun doing it.

Genkai quests
AF quests
SOLO (Yes it was viable for any class even in the "Early days")
Umpteen ammounts of quests that were extremly fulfilling either by reward of rare and expensive spells or priceless maps.
Friends to play with
Friends to help
Friends to explore with

Funny thing is I never had to be a specific level to help/play/laugh with my friends. My level was irrelivant in the long run, we did things because we wanted too. Not for the gear, not for the reward, but for the hell of it, just to see the person you helped say "Thanks man!"

Short sightedness like people spewing bile at the leveling process in a game upsets me because it's in that "Grind" where friendships and bonds are formed. People working towards a common goal, when you take all the challenge out of that it just becomes...boring.

PLing in XI was a far cry from what it is in XIV, having unlimited healing and having somone utterly destroy a group of monsters for you are two totally different stories. If Yoshida wants us to help our friends out...that's perfectly fine. Just don't let us do all the work for our friends, thats just stupid.

[RathSkybreaker]

What is everyone's problem with putting a little bit of time into games.. I don't want to grind.. I want to hit cap.. really? In an mmo theres really only 4 things that hit me as fun..
1. Community
2. Economy
3. Content
4. The Journey..

by getting rid of the grind and the time put in, you lose that feeling of a tight-knit community, the economy is screwed up because everyone is cap meaning most low-mid core gear is not used as much, or inflated due to the low demand - high time input, content is rushed, all lower content seemingly becomes obsolete, and the journey is drastically shortened with the end goal being meager at the end of the day because everyone's gotten there so fast... 1 day is nuts 2-3 weeks is bad, 1-2 months I think is acceptable.. you earn your place, you meet people, and if its fun, people won't have a problem putting in the time...

[Hanemakikaze]

Let's try this again, shall we?

Pre ToAU
Group composition: Tank, healer, 4x support/damage (one is also puller)
The action chain we get is: Pull > Manage mob positioning > Manage hate > Coordinate WS for SC and MB
If we add a THF or /THF we also add the action of Manage player positioning.

Post ToAU
Group composition: 1x healer/support hybrid, 5x support/damage (one is also puller)
The action chain we get is: Pull > Spam WS with impunity
There is zero need for any kind of coordination. You don't even have to pay attention to what the rest of the group is doing.

Fast exp is nice when it's a reward for excellence. When it's just given to you on a silver platter because the game is deigned that way, you may as well eliminate the leveling process entirely, which is exactly what you seem to want. So, why exactly do you torture yourself by playing MMORPGs?

K, please show me where I say anywhere that I want game handed to me. Also I dunno what game you were playing but yeah, you needed a tank for birds AND Crawlers unless you were far over its level or on equal grounds. Meaning, when people first enter there, which was around 56 if i remember, there's no way you're getting effective exp without a tank. You could not do what you're saying under well in the mid to late 60s which is damn close to be capped anyway so you've "experienced" everything already. And I'm torturing myself how exactly, take a deep breath and go look back and read where it says I quit XI then come back and finish what you're trying to say. Because I'm pretty damn sure this game is nothing like XI.