[dev1206] Class Reforms & Action Lists

[Hulan]

Haven't been in the Ifrit fight yet, have you?

If that battle is indicative of future content then most of LNC's current skills would have been useless anyway as we're not fight mobs that stand in a line and wait for a lancer to wipe their TP. Blindside + Doomspike II is the life of a LNC atm.

It's hard to call that list a nerf when they are the new glass cannon. I call it balance.

I do not believe he was calling it a nerf so much as a... stylistic difference in opinion. I personally agree. The hybrid DD-support role that LNC was originally imagined as was extremely appealing to me, and this current trend of making them pure DD is somewhat disheartening. That being said, there are plenty of things to like still. I have to say, PGL, for all of the fact that managing your MP may be difficult, sounds absolutely fascinating now.

[Sole]

i wonder if CON/WHM won't be as needed with all the HP abilities spread through GLA/PLD and brd, etc

[JGwinters]

I do not believe he was calling it a nerf so much as a... stylistic difference in opinion. I personally agree. The hybrid DD-support role that LNC was originally imagined as was extremely appealing to me, and this current trend of making them pure DD is somewhat disheartening. That being said, there are plenty of things to like still. I have to say, PGL, for all of the fact that managing your MP may be difficult, sounds absolutely fascinating now.

Right on. Although I did use the word nerf, as changing a support-DD into a DD is exactly what a nerf is to me: removing of its mastering of control. In other words, a nerf. Adding more DD-capability doesn't factor into it, it's that they removed the support capabilities that matters.

And Sephrick..no, I haven't been to the Ifrit battle. Like I said in a previous post I almost exclusively solo and duo. Naturally, if you're an end-game type of person this makes your definitions wildly different from mine when it comes to what a nerf is and what matters in a class.

[Atoli]

Oh great, just give all the element based skills to THM, because that makes sense..
Goodbye FFXIV, I was willing to pay for this game before I read they were basically killing the CNJ class, but not anymore.

Oh, and MRD/Warrior becoming the main tank instead of Paladin, which would have made at least ANY sense and PUG as a magic hybrid? Hybrid builds are always useless..not that PUG was anything but useless before either though.
Great job SE, killing the only three classes that were fun to me.
*ragequit*

[Firon]

Oh great, just give all the element based skills to THM, because that makes sense..
Goodbye FFXIV, I was willing to pay for this game before I read they were basically killing the CNJ class, but not anymore.

Oh, and MRD/Warrior becoming the main tank instead of Paladin, which would have made at least ANY sense and PUG as a magic hybrid? Hybrid builds are always useless..not that PUG was anything but useless before either though.
Great job SE, killing the only three classes that were fun to me.
*ragequit*

Where did you read MRd becoming the main tank >.>. I'll hold my breath for pgl i will see how it works out

[Elexia]

Oh great, just give all the element based skills to THM, because that makes sense..
Goodbye FFXIV, I was willing to pay for this game before I read they were basically killing the CNJ class, but not anymore.

Oh, and MRD/Warrior becoming the main tank instead of Paladin, which would have made at least ANY sense and PUG as a magic hybrid? Hybrid builds are always useless..not that PUG was anything but useless before either though.
Great job SE, killing the only three classes that were fun to me.
*ragequit*

Cya. Paladin will clearly be the main tank, but I guess we read different lists.

[Atoli]

Cya. Paladin will clearly be the main tank, but I guess we read different lists.

I read the localized version, but I don't think there's a huge difference just because it's a translation.
What I read was "hate-gain-skill 1", "hate-gain-skill 2",..."hate-gain-skill 5", "def-up-skill" + various attack skills and a description of the class saying "takes all the dmg the monsters deal while dealing some dmg himself".
Sorry for thinking that's the basic definition of TANK..
Whereas the description of GLA was "Oh, you deal a tiny little bit of dmg so you can't pull hate at all, but we give you nice healing skills to help others and a few aggro-pulling-skills as well so with all your useless def, so you can at least help out RD with tanking"?
Okay, I'm not saying Paladin is not ging to be tanking alot, too.
I'm just saying MRD will have to do a lot more tanking than before..
I don't really mind though, I'm even fine with the way PUG is going to work, because that's something that I want to try before saying it REALLY will be bad.

But what I KNOW is bad is what they did with CNJ and THM, and it makes me upset enough to quit without playing after 1.20.

[Elexia]

-snip-

What I read was Paladin would be able to maintain hate better. While MRD can boost defense, including the defense of a Paladin, Paladin also has cures which unless SE adjusts it, produces a decent amount of enmity especially abilities that restores your party member's HP as well as your own in one go.

[Krausus]

I read the localized version, but I don't think there's a huge difference just because it's a translation.
What I read was "hate-gain-skill 1", "hate-gain-skill 2",..."hate-gain-skill 5", "def-up-skill" + various attack skills and a description of the class saying "takes all the dmg the monsters deal while dealing some dmg himself".
Sorry for thinking that's the basic definition of TANK..
Whereas the description of GLA was "Oh, you deal a tiny little bit of dmg so you can't pull hate at all, but we give you nice healing skills to help others and a few aggro-pulling-skills as well so with all your useless def, so you can at least help out RD with tanking"?
Okay, I'm not saying Paladin is not ging to be tanking alot, too.
I'm just saying MRD will have to do a lot more tanking than before..
I don't really mind though, I'm even fine with the way PUG is going to work, because that's something that I want to try before saying it REALLY will be bad.

But what I KNOW is bad is what they did with CNJ and THM, and it makes me upset enough to quit without playing after 1.20.

Hate gaining abilities:

Temporarily reduces damage you sustain and increases enmity generated by actions executed while effect is active.

Temporarily increases the defense of all party members within range. Generates massive enmity.

Increases target's enmity. Traits may trigger an AoE and a chance to inflict Stun.

Melee attack.
Combo: GLD WS 1, Bonus: Increased enmity.

Increases enmity of all enemies within range. Can only be used immediately after blocking an attack.

Defense and heal abilities:

Temporarily reduces damage you sustain and increases enmity generated by actions executed while effect is active.

Blocks the next attack made against you and grants HP in proportion to damage sustained.

Increases block rate and grants TP for each block made while effect is active.

Grants imperviousness to melee attacks. Effect fades upon moving.

Restores target's HP. When cast on another player, restores 50% of their HP in addition to a portion of your own.

Add to that the amount of enmity generated from heals and I think Glad/Paladin will make an amazing great tank.

[Griss]

Cya. Paladin will clearly be the main tank, but I guess we read different lists.

as far as "Main tank" its all about style and situation.

Gladiator has always represented the calm and cool defensive type.

Marauder has always represented the wild and possibly crazy offensive type.

the jobs are just going to amplify that.

If people are still having trouble grasping that then refer to the following visual aid.