Thread: Making Jobs Rotationally Easier in 4.0

Originally Posted by Falar

If they lower tank dps anymore I'm done tanking.

I actually enjoy it in this game since you can do ok dps unlike other MMOs I'v eplayed where a tank does like 25% the damage of a dps.

MMOs are abandoning the idea of a tank doing a fraction of a DPS' overall damage, largely because killing things while soloing/questing takes a looooog time if you make tank damage output low (which in turn makes less people want to level a tank, which means if your game has a group finder option, you're going to have that much harder a time finding one). The problem here is that raids measure tanks not by their mitigation (like in every other game) but by how much damage they deal, and that's incredibly lopsided logic. That leads to other things (tanks making themselves take more damage for more DPS, belittling of those who take issue with that) that, to me, are causes for concern.

Barring making soloing unbearable, low damage didn't really bother me; then again, I've played tanks for almost a decade, most of which were designed to deal a lot less damage than the DPS (try playing a tank built mostly around 0-damage enmity generators; weep as you barely register on the DPS meters <,<).

Originally Posted by Drakkaelus

It's a problem most MMOs have had since the beginning. Simply standing there, getting punched in the face and not feeling like you're contributing beyond taking a bullet for someone playing a class with all the, "cool" spells isn't going to sound all that appealing to a lot of players.

That sort of depends on the person. I used to have the ability to slam my weapon to the ground to create a cone of damage that stunned everything in front of me, and if I stomped the ground thunder would crash down and a 5-foot crater would appear at the point I stomped that would slow the attack speed of everyone around me. Tanks can have cool abilities, and they don't have to be focused on just damage.

I think MMOs have painted themselves into a corner by reserving all the fun, flashy stuff exclusively for DPS classes for so long while tanks get...shield bash. Now they're at the point where they have to practically bribe people to play tanks.

You still have the people that don't want the responsibility of wanting to play a tank. It takes colossal amounts of bribery to get those people to take up the role. And the results would be dubious.

Non-sequitur

Originally Posted by FallenWings

So you've kept your hate above all your teammates.

Then what?

Then everyone else does their thing, while the tank continues doing theirs.

So you can survive the tank buster,

Now what?

You continue holding aggro and trying to stay alive.

What separates you from a common tank that can meet the same check?

Does there need to be a separation? Tanks generally don't stroke themselves over claims of skill.

How else have you impacted the fight after meeting those two checks?

Depends on how the tank is designed. There's also mechanics to take into account. A tank doesn't just sit in a corner doing nothing while they take hits.

Yes, all you've done is allow the possibility for "greatly" depleting the bosses' hp.

Not "all", but that's a part of the tank role. The rest is filled by whatever incidental damage you dealt while generating aggro (Shield Oath+Goring Blade/Royal Authority in between Rage of Halone applications) and if you have any group utility (Reprisal, Divine Veil, Aegis of Light, Demoralizing Shout, Commanding Shout, Anti-Magic Zone back when that could be used in PvE, etc).

Any further input from you as a player beyond enabling that bare minimum necessity for completion, means nothing.

See my above mention of utility if the tank has access to it.

Why does a hulking greataxe/greatsword or the iconic broad/short/longsword pathetically bounce off the most snuggly moogle when a kitchen knife causes said moogle to violently explode into guts, bones and other visceral matter?

If you want it in one word, balance. And I wouldn't say they bounce off; they just don't cut as deep. And it's fine, because likewise that moogle can smash the kitchen knife-wielder into paste while the greatsword/greataxe/sword&board guy simply takes the hit and asks for someone to close whatever window is open because they just felt a draft.