Concerns about " Getting rid of unused and ineffective actions"

[SaitoHikari]

-snip-

Yeah, unfortunately if the devs ever do that, I see PLD losing their cross classes from WHM. Either that, or they'll end up getting replacement skills that function in a similar way/at least Protect and Stoneskin will be built right into PLD tree to make up for it.

[Jonnycbad]

Feint is actually decent at mid-low levels for when the target isn't immune, because it's pretty potent. To make it more useful at higher levels make it lower the target's evasion or something. Haymaker could be like an FF "Counter" wherein it has a 50% proc chance anytime the MNK receives damage (including from raid-wide AoE) and buff it's potency to 250 and make it an oGCD, additional effect: reduces target's damage by 5% or something.

[Lambdafish]

Yeah, unfortunately if the devs ever do that, I see PLD losing their cross classes from WHM. Either that, or they'll end up getting replacement skills that function in a similar way/at least Protect and Stoneskin will be built right into PLD tree to make up for it.

I really hope you are right. The devs need to have a serious think about PLDs job identity, and also work out a way to compensate PLD (as well as DRG) for the skills that they will inevitably lose with this change to the system. As it stands, PLD will lose Provoke, Convalescence, Awareness(?), and potentially Flash (though this will probably just be excempt from the system, and hopefully changed). They are also the only job that will potentially lose an entire cross class job from their list (to be replaced with DRK... hooray for homogenization), healers won't lose BLM skills, as all healers have BLM as a cross class, so the relevant skills will be kept for all healers.

[tymora]

Back in the 2.0 days people would sleep stuff and kill only the stuff that would open gates and skip the rest of the trash, so now everything is immune to sleep.

Wanderer's Palace was one of the biggest offenders, skipping tons of trash mobs by sleeping stuff specifically pulling the entire first hallway from the beginning, killing the tonberry that opens the door and locking all the trash out with the boss seal.

They could always just easily make the condition to be "Kill all mobs to open doors", instead of making sleep useless...

[Loyd64]

Yeah, unfortunately if the devs ever do that, I see PLD losing their cross classes from WHM. Either that, or they'll end up getting replacement skills that function in a similar way/at least Protect and Stoneskin will be built right into PLD tree to make up for it.

I wouldn't mind having a similar cross class system but with two sections, one with abilities for your role, and one for that job, have like 4 choices for each and be able to select 6, or 3 of each, and have it be a bit more style based, like for a tank, a choice of two buffs, one decreases damage taken for 10 seconds, but reduces damage done, and have another thats opposite, and you can only pick one. Some may like the extra tank cd, while others may like the other.

[Lokier]

snip.

I believe Yoshida reassured that with the changes to cross class abilities certain classes will be given spells they need but don't have, so I'd assume things like provoke, etc, will just automatically be given to tank classes so they don't need to level a pala' to obtain it any more. Since things like provoke are a necessity for dual-tanking, not an option.

I think what will happen is they'll take necessity cross-class spells and just give them to classes that need them to function, whilst maybe making new, or rebuilding on current in-game, spells that are optional but not essential. Perhaps in an attempt to eliminate this issue with people levelling one class but not another, and hopefully attempting to lead classes and jobs down the route of "I levelled it because I wanted to, not because I have to" scenario.
A few people have voiced their distaste for being forced to level something they didn't want to level to get along in the game, giving up valuable time they would have liked to have used levelling the class of their choice. Luckily POTD has dealt with this issue somewhat, since you can just unlock your two needed classes in less than maybe seven hours and get back to what you want to do, level the class of your choice.

[Nezerius]

They could always just easily make the condition to be "Kill all mobs to open doors", instead of making sleep useless...

In that case, people would just AoE everything down, making sleep just as useless in that situation.

[Lambdafish]

snip

I read it more as an overhaul to the cross class system itself (granted, this is necessary). My only concern is how this affects PLD/WHM/DRG, arguably the 3 classes in this game that most of the relevant cross class skills come from (perhaps BLM too). These classes will have their skills taken and made into role abilities (it makes more sense to have provoke as a tank ability than creating 3 provokes), however these classes that held all the cross class skills now have less unique skills (arguably this was true anyway, but now they are making it official). This is why my worry for PLD is so valid, the two cross class skills that made it unique (stoneskin and protect) could potentially be straight up taken away.

I know we don't have enough information to go on, but on the other hand I need to be reassured that PLD will keep its identity as a support heavy tank. The only reassurance that has been given is that jobs will be given the relevant skills that they need (probably directly talking about WAR/DRK getting the PLD skills that they need, or DPS getting the DRG skills that they need)

[Avenger]

IMHO, the creative ways one uses those "unused and ineffective actions" is what separates okay players from great players.

This - although my hotbar is exploding, I really like the idea and possibility of coming up with creative ways of using or combining various less-popular spells or skills. ;-)

[Terrini]

This is why my worry for PLD is so valid, the two cross class skills that made it unique (stoneskin and protect) could potentially be straight up taken away.

I know we don't have enough information to go on, but on the other hand I need to be reassured that PLD will keep its identity as a support heavy tank. The only reassurance that has been given is that jobs will be given the relevant skills that they need (probably directly talking about WAR/DRK getting the PLD skills that they need, or DPS getting the DRG skills that they need)

Alternatively, they could be given to all tanks, and that also takes away PLD's uniqueness. With the most popular cross-class skills getting merged into a general pool, the jobs that provided these skills need to get at the very least passive bonuses to make them more effective or unique than just the general pool.