With Eve gone, only sub based MMOs left are FFXIV and WoW

[KarstenS]

League Of Legends, Crossfire, Dungeon Fighter Online, Worlds Of Tanks and DOTA2 are not MMORPG...
So, the three best grossing MMORPG are...pay to play...

Thats the little thing why this graphics should get read closer. Its just talking about MMO not MMORPG. The list would look very different, if non RPG games would be not shown in this list.

[Aylis]

FFXIV seems to take after SWTOR; especially after the Stormblood trailer, very reminiscent of the new SWOTR expansion trailer.

Korean F2P isn't so bad, the only P2W games I can think of would be Facebook games. If they would look at F2P they should look more closely at the Korean models or at least do what SWTOR does. Wow is going to be killed soon by Blizzard so Pay to play will almost be a thing of the past.

This game would probably be most viable for the SWTOR FTP style of model...Which is kinda worrysome for some maybe...even though expected at the same time. SWTOR and FFXIV share the same similarites in that the games are really there for the fans of the series. So those fans would have no issues paying the optional monthly sub for the games and go about their merry little way. SWTOR as a game is great even when most would agree its FTP plan is abyssmal. Want to do more then three flashpoints or star ship missions a week? Pay a sub or buy a lock out remover from the cash shop once per week. Want to use legendary equipment? Buy a sub or pay for a character or account wide restriction remover. As a FTP player in SWTOR even I didn't really mind the restrictions as much. Then again I'm not a super Star Wars fan that felt the need to either sub or buy through restrictions. It was just a merry Star Wars adventure that I did enjoy, and even with the restrictions I didn't really feel restricted. So I could see that FTP model work well here if a player is just looking for a merry Final Fantasy adventure while not taking the game as serious as a series fan would.

The Korean FTP style I love the most though I won't lie but the way this game works it wouldn't really fit. Not without a major amounts of the games systems being reworked from the ground up. Mostly dealing with equipment progression. For those that never played a Korean MMO before. Equipment isn't exactly replaced by a new piece usually. Equipment progresses and evolves. Like.....

Okay, in Tera Online...in endgame a player would first grind a dungeon until they got the equipment piece they wanted, now the evolving comes in. First a player would get a scroll..I forget the name of it but what it does is basically "black out" the equipment piece to make it unidentifyable stat and effects wise. The player would then use an identification scroll to basically reroll the equipment piece. A player would do this until RNG smiles upon them and the equipment identifies as "Mastercraft" which means it can be boosted to +12 instead of +9. The player would then hope RNG smiles on them as they use a lot of Alkestz and tiers gear shards (gotten through de-synthing weapons and armor) and eventually through RNG failures it becomes +12.

Blade and Soul uses a similar path in evolving where basically players continue to use the same weapon and accessories they got between level 1-10 and through the use of items that come from the game evolve it as they go about their journey.

It goes without saying the bread and butter from these games comes from lockbox and other RNG based goodie events. They work so well because even if a player opens one and doesn't get the big shiny they hoped for. The player is always promised to get at least something they'll need for equipment evolving later on.

"*opens a box* aw dang, I didn't get the special outfit...Oh hey look 10x Item! Let me bank those for later! " That FTP system works for those games, it really wouldn't work here since it wouldn't be a big seller because how can you be promised something you'll need across the board to all players.

[Aylis]

I was reading that one line about F2P adding toxicity and I LUL'd. FFXIV has a very toxic community, if you don't agree with the FFXIV crowd about how great the game is even when it's boring you better get ready to burn in Hell XD.

I got a laugh out of it too lol. My go to FTP games are Blade and Soul, Wildstar and Guildwars 2...I could count the number of toxic players I've crossed path with on maybe two hands...I fear I would need an abacus to keep track of all the toxic people I've crossed paths with in FFXIV :/

[NatSilverguard]

Unless things have changed since the announcement, EVE is planning to go F2P in November. Or in the least have a F2P model.

And did you at all bother to read the links I provided? I'm assuming not. Because if you did.. you would have read that CCP (the company that creates EVE Online) is planning for it to go F2P in November. Next month.

One of the links.. is actually EVE Online's community site.

Unless I'm spouting old news that has since changed.. I have no issue with admitting I'm wrong, but I'm not doing so with people that aren't going to acknowledge the info I've provided.

you misunderstood dude, let me try and explain.

in this feature, there will be 2 types of clones (the character) instead of one and those are: the alpha (free/trial) and the omega (w/ sub).

the alpha clone will be very limited, you will be racially locked and can fly cruisers and below only ships; limited skills you can use (even if you trained them already) and the rate of experience accumulation will be slowed down to half the normal rate. i think the exp cap. will also be at 5M only.

on the other hand, omega clone will be like the normal clone we have now having access to all ships and skills (if trained) when subbed.

so if a veteran having 100M exp points (or what we call SP = skill points) didn't pay the monthly sub, his clone will be converted to an alpha clone (form an omega clone) and lock most of his skills and abilities. so i don't see how veterans will stop paying sub.

[NatSilverguard]

dangerously off-topic, but the cool kids are in wormholes

nah FW/lowsec is where the action is.

[Kyuuen]

snip

Currently the game operates on a Sub model after your 14 day trial, in which you HAVE to sub to keep playing the game. But you're saying that you will be able to keep playing; indefinitely, without paying a dime, even though heavily restricted, but you will be able to play the game.

Sounds like a F2P model to me. Which is all I've been saying.

snip

I fully understood that, no explanation was needed. What people seem to think is that just because you're not getting to enjoy all the features that Sub model players enjoy, that you're some how not playing the damn game.

Is it limited by a time frame as a trial typically is? No. Are you ever required to pay to play the game? No, unless you want all the bells and whistles that Sub models enjoy. Logically speaking... that sounds like a F2P model.

[Jandor]

Apologies if you responded to this before my editing... over reacted and jumped to conclusions.
[snip]
You don't get to redefine F2P just because you don't like the option available.

[snip]
Is it limited by a time frame as a trial typically is? No. Are you ever required to pay to play the game? No, unless you want all the bells and whistles that Sub models enjoy. Logically speaking... that sounds like a F2P model.

I appreciate the apology, not often you see that on the internet. Thanks.

I'm not trying to redefine F2P though. Look, I don't know how much experience you have with Eve, but you seem to framing it as free with a subscription that grants some nice optional extras. It's not though, the limits are almost excessively restrictive to anyone who's spent a bit of time in game, new players won't particularly notice or care but by removing the time limit they can get veterans with lapsed accounts to log back in and chat with old friends. A good chunk of them with probably resub as a result, it's pretty clever to be fair.

Putting 'EVE F2P mode' in FFXIV terms though, it's like being limited to level 30 on your starting class, no other battle classes, no jobs, max level 5 on crafter and gathering classes & no retainers. You could play like that for a bit but honestly, advertising that sort of heavily diminished experience as F2P FFXIV would be pretty misleading at best.

[Kyuuen]

I appreciate the apology, not often you see that on the internet. Thanks.

I'm not trying to redefine F2P though. Look, I don't know how much experience you have with Eve, but you seem to framing it as free with a subscription that grants some nice optional extras. It's not though, the limits are almost excessively restrictive to anyone who's spent a bit of time in game, new players won't particularly notice or care but by removing the time limit they can get veterans with lapsed accounts to log back in and chat with old friends. A good chunk of them with probably resub as a result, it's pretty clever to be fair.

Putting 'EVE F2P mode' in FFXIV terms though, it's like being limited to level 30 on your starting class, no other battle classes, no jobs, max level 5 on crafter and gathering classes & no retainers. You could play like that for a bit but honestly, advertising that sort of heavily diminished experience as F2P FFXIV would be pretty misleading at best.

And yet it's the users choice to then:

A) Quit
B) Continue playing for free
C) Subscribe

A Trial is something that has a defined end, as it is a trial. EVE's current trial is that of 14 days, after which you have a choice, Sub or leave. From what they've said so far, this will not have an end. Much like the old "Trial" version of WinRAR. Did everything; at least from what I remember, that the full version did, but the trial never ended. Granted as you said, this version of EVE some features will be locked and even have caps, BUT if it is the players choice to continue playing for free even with all the locks and caps on features, then it is considered a F2P model.. no matter how scant the features.

Though honestly at this point, I think it's safe to say that we agree to disagree on the matter. Because I don't see myself budging on this topic nor you. ^^;

Anyways to get on topic.. seeing as I haven't been since I stepped into this thread...

I'm fine with XIV remaining Sub only with the cash shop. What I disagree on with the cash shop is the price of some of the stuff, in particular the mounts... I'm sorry, but nearly $30 for just a mount is a bit much... for that I better be getting some extra content.

[Vexander]

I do like the Cash Shop, but agree that some things on it should be available in game. The Odin Mount, dyes, some of the costumes, etc... what I don't mind is the Cash Shop making available items that are no longer available from past events. Like Halloween Costumes.

That said, I'd like to see the sub model remain, but wouldn't mind a Lifetime Sub option either.

[Jandor]

[snip]

Yeah I guess we'll have to agree to disagree. That's fine, it seems it's mostly semantics at this point anyway .

I've been calling it a trial because the restrictions in place are similar to a lot of MMO trials, it's the terminology most people are familiar with. More accurately I suppose would be 'demo', to me the proposed mode seems most similar to those old demo discs you used to get back when games came on CDs, you could play those forever without spending money on them but you couldn't really say you got the game for free.