Changes I would like to see for ninja in Stormblood

[Khalithar]

Now on to useless skills

- Throwing Dagger

- Fuma shuriken

- Poisons

- Smoke Screen and Shadewalker

- Hyoton

Throwing Dagger/Fuma Shuriken- Each melee class needs some sort of ranged attack to pull things from a distance, I think we can all agree on that right? How about when you become a Nin, Fuma Shuriken replaces Throwing Dagger and the first Ninjutsu you get becomes Raiton instead.

Poisons- I'd rather see them scrapped honestly. Have the important buffs/debuffs folded in to the normal skills and adjust the damage numbers accordingly.

Smoke/Shade- Useful in raids and/or when you have an undergeared tank.

Hyoton- Useful in PVP, plus since it's a ninjutsu spell it doesn't take up precious hotbar space, I'll let it pass.

[shweppers]

Are we all going to ignore the crapfest that is Mug? As it stands, it has two flavors, both of which are terrible.
- Maybe get a small handful of extra items, IF you were going to get some items in the first place, and even then it is inconsistently applied

- You get 50% of a 140 potency attack back as health.... WHOOOO!!!!!

All this on a 140 potency 90 second cooldown OGCD damage!!

Given the lore from Mug, I think the idea of both these effects is fitting, but the rate of return needs to be significantly increased. With a 90s cooldown timer, the item drop from an enemy should be guaranteed. Being able to speed up farming by 5% is not OP.

As for the life steal, for a 90s cooldown, it needs to be boosted. It doesn't have to be on second wind level (which is 450 potency on a 120s cooldown), but it should somewhere in the neighborhood of a 250-300 potency heal that scales with attack power. Anything less, and why even bother?

[Shurrikhan]

Poisons- I'd rather see them scrapped honestly. Have the important buffs/debuffs folded in to the normal skills and adjust the damage numbers accordingly.

Been thinking about this little bit a lot lately, and it makes me think of an actual customization system by which we could select how prominent we want poisons to be, where the highest prominence has the highest potential output but also the most risk and therefore skill requirement, and that increase in skill requirement is honestly a bit higher than the increase in dps. Not sure what can of worms that would open up though. Almost sounds like a left-right selector between Thief and Assassin, or the poison toggle as taking up a cross-class slot, except without having to lose anything for taking it, and losing potentially nothing for skipping it, either.

If that balance was more prominent, I could almost imagine the Thief side as using Mug in order to gain stolen item actions, similar to Ninjutsu, while Poisons become a far more interesting and integral concept for Assassin. But then you might as well Ninja into that trio and then you just have three jobs stemming from the same class, with slightly less breadth in each, just to have more total variety and to really bring out the mechanics given to the current amalgamate Ninja.

[ReplicaX]

Now on to useless skills
- Throwing Dagger
- Fuma shuriken
- Smoke Screen and Shadewalker

Throwing Dagger
- useful on solo pulls or content without a tank with Ninjutsu on CD (PotD as an example)
- Dodging mechanics outside of melee with Ninjutsu on CD, can still use Throwing Dagger instead of standing there.

Fuma
Plenty have mentioned the advantages, use in certain party makeups, and its the only physical dmg Ninjutsu.

Smoke Screen and Shadewalker
- BLM opener crits were a great example.
- Anything that helps a MT or even situational switch tanking on Enmity is a plus in my book when used properly.
- Also they do help with under geared tanks in random DF/Roulettes, besides Raid content.

[Balipu]

1. Throwing dagger is a rather weak 120 potency ranged attack for for 120 TP. rather lackluster, and overshadowed by mudras if they are off cooldown.

2. Fuma shuriken.... oh dear...

3.Poisons- well.. I can half agree with your assessment. I want more variation to what the poisons apply.

4. Hyoton is useless in PvE. Binds in PvP however, are quite powerful. While PvP is a tacked-on and mostly an afterthought for FF14, simply removing that ability in PvP just because PvE exists woult ONLY harm ninja. its a net loss without compensation. I do not approve.

5.The "problem" that DoTs and Debuffs "dont last long enough and don't hit hard enough".

Honestly, I feel DoTs fit NIN as a class fantasy more than pulling out a mallet 3x your size and bonking people with it. .

1. Sooo maybe it needs a rework. Or at least a high level trait, doesn't it?
2. You are right, Fuma has nothing to do with AoE. But Katon hits EVERY target for a little OVER what normal unpoisoned, dancing edge-less Shuriken does. I checked my damage numbers over and over again. And I still think it is pretty dumb that we need to be in melee range (for dancing edge) to really effectively use an ability that is meant to be a ranged attack.
3. So you DO agree that something must be done with them as what we have now is not enough.
4. Never said anything about removing. It just needs more work. Or maybe make it a PVP ability and replace it in PVE with a mundra that actually HAS a point in PVE.
5. You misunderstood this as well. My problem isn't that they don't hit hard enough. If they didn't I wouldn't bother with them. My problem is while dots are far better as a class fantasy than pulling out a mallet for bonking, it would be even nicer to pull out a smoke grenade, disappear. reappear behind the enemy, stab them in the back, disappear again, lure another enemy into a trap, then use a transformation or an illusion on the rest. My idea/wish would be to give the dots/status efffects a longer duration to give more time to other tricks, but lessen their effects to make it fair. The dps taken from the dots could go to other tricks. And we are definitely going to get new tricks with the increased level cap.

[Ilan]

Fuma Shuriken is still the only physical Ninjutsu, it is faster than Raiton or Katon, slashing debuff can come from a WAR too. It is usefull even if you don't see it that way.

[FyrmurlFloerasksyn]

Now that i think about it, FS should probably be an ogcd attack. You don't see ninja using hand signs to throw a shuriken.

[Shurrikhan]

Now that i think about it, FS should probably be an ogcd attack. You don't see ninja using hand signs to throw a shuriken.

Though you'd need the signs to summon one...
I mean, just wear would they be taking that giant thing out of otherwise...?

[FyrmurlFloerasksyn]

Though you'd need the signs to summon one...
I mean, just wear would they be taking that giant thing out of otherwise...?

*where
and why does it have to be a gigantic one? It could simply be a smaller one.

[Ahrniel]

If that balance was more prominent, I could almost imagine the Thief side as using Mug in order to gain stolen item actions

Too much GW2 there sadly. I'd rather have mug apply a random debuff based on what kind of thing was mugged.