Ifirit, how it could have been done better.

[NoctisUmbra]

And if you really, truly think that the only problem with this loot system is duplicates then I hope for your sake you don't get unlucky on moogle drops.

It's not the only problem with the loot system. It is the main problem with the drop rates seeming much lower than they actually are. Loot system is going to be changed for a sort of Need/Greed system. Yoshi said as much.

[RemVye]

And if you really, truly think that the only problem with this loot system is duplicates then I hope for your sake you don't get unlucky on moogle drops.

I'll take my time and enjoy the fight.

I already conveyed solutions, some of which Yoshi maybe endorsing... what's your problem? You want auto-loot; then you should play a game that has that.

[Hikozaemon]

He has been over this. The current system is working as intended. The drop rate as well as the random nature of loot serves as a time sink to keep players occupied until 1.20. As soon as they can roll out enough content to keep people occupied, they will most likely implement a need/greed system.

theres no damn random nature in getting 5 Ifrits Canes in 20+ kills My 17Conj really needed that cane. Not like i would like a Greataxe for my MRD or Fists for my PUG no i need more Ifrits canes. I wish i could shove all those cane drops up Yoshis ass and see how he likes gettin shafted like me.

[Dakin]

theres no damn random nature in getting 5 Ifrits Canes in 20+ kills My 17Conj really needed that cane. Not like i would like a Greataxe for my MRD or Fists for my PUG no i need more Ifrits canes. I wish i could shove all those cane drops up Yoshis ass and see how he likes gettin shafted like me.

That is actually a perfect example of how random the loot distribution is, if there is a certain % chance for 1) an item dropping from the chest and 2) the same % for each item.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gambler's_fallacy

[elreed]

So reading this few last posts, if the loot is the problem why dont we get a common mat and combined with other difficult mats you can make the weapon of your choice, i really dont like how the loot is atm at first with first NM's it was a lot more interesting system there, in order to get a drop you had to incapacitate the mob for a sure craft material, then you had to get a few more items mostly sold, others gotten in the same way like the dodore doublet, so at the end you would end up needing a crafter to get your armor or weapon, whats wrong with that?

I think those gears lasted a lot more than the ones that we are getting now, even now after 1 year theres a lot of people using those, so in a few words i prefer by far the system we had and not the WoW style, where you have the extreme easy way to get all and for that everything becomes outdated sooner because even casual players find that boring after a while, back in XI i was more like a casual player so i never got the best of the best but i got good enough gear and was happy about it and i always focused on getting the best gear, so i never got bored.

This is an MMO, so everything should take more effort to get so other players may focus on something and you may be able to enjoy those items longer.

[Bahn]

They just need to do one of two things to fix this problem:
1) Make the Ifrit loot system use the same loot system as everything else does at the moment. That way, if the item drops, you can give it to the right LS mate that can use it.
2) Make the item something you can turn in to an NPC to exchange for the weapon you want.

Why they did the Ifrit loot system in the first place, attempting to fix something that wasn't broken in the first place, blows my mind. Did people really ask for this ass-backwards Ifrit loot system?

Also, I do agree the low droprate is retarded. But that's the RNG for you - people think that because they "worked" for it by killing Ifrit 200 times and finally getting that item that you should go through the same shit too, Brannigan. They forget that it's just a stupid time sink that artificially lengthens the longevity of what little endgame content there is.

The players you are arguing with, Brannigan, may have a point that part of the reason why you and some other players may be complaining is that Lady Luck wasn't at your side, but I definitely agree with your argument that after the 9001st kill, you've already proven that you have the skill and strategy to kill him, it's just a matter of actually having that dumb RNG properly roll out towards your favor.

What I find even more ironic about this whole situation is that at some point, should XIV survive within the next year, there will probably be plans for an expansion that render these old weapons that players "worked" so hard for old and obsolete, and we'll probably have to deal with this retarded loot system again if SE doesn't learn their lesson.

[Jamester]

The difficulty of the fight should justify the power of the item. The reason it's fine to have to have low success rates on forbidden materia is because there's no difficulty, no skill, no thought, no pulse required. Ifrit's insanely low drop rates aren't justified considering the content of the fight. The super low drop rates are only "obvious" if you're designing a shitty system.

The success rate of triple-melding something should be exceedingly low because it requires no thought. The Ifrit drop rates are retarded. It takes like 350 runs to get a full set of weapons. I, personally, am something like 1/50 (I stopped keeping track after I started punching myself in the dick). The problem IS the low drop rate and the fact that the consolation prize is dark matter instead of a turn-in item that you can collect (for the record I don't think that he should drop crafting materials)

Pressing a button and playing a slot machine is the same thing as defeating a boss with a group. Cool.

It requires much more than you think mate. To get a 3x IV item requires a lots of time & gil, you either earn the money to buy materias or spiritbond it urself (usually in a group as well). You also have to make the weapons/equips for melding and often you are going to dye the items because they have better stats (costly & time consuming). For felt sets you might have to farm karakul fleece yourself too. Then you try to HQ items or alter the combinations to get a better %. Its alot of hard work in there. Pressing the “Absolutely!” Button is just that last step of the whole process and I am sure some people think a lot & hold their breath before they press that button.

I definitely agree a better distribution system is needed so the player who gets the drop can pass it to others. But if you wanna get a full set of ifrit weapons…then you have to try a lot of times. At least you don’t have to pay to visit Ifrit for 350 times

[RemVye]

So reading this few last posts, if the loot is the problem why dont we get a common mat and combined with other difficult mats you can make the weapon of your choice, i really dont like how the loot is atm at first with first NM's it was a lot more interesting system there, in order to get a drop you had to incapacitate the mob for a sure craft material, then you had to get a few more items mostly sold, others gotten in the same way like the dodore doublet, so at the end you would end up needing a crafter to get your armor or weapon, whats wrong with that?
.

This was already explained... the crafters make the best items in the game already, why should they have control over the second best as well?

Multi Materia Gear/Weps > Ex/Rare NM drops > Single Materia Gear/Weps > No Materia Gear/Weps

So you want crafters to have control over all gear in the entire game? That's the problem.

[Fiosha_Maureiba]

This has probably been said somewhere in this thread. The compromise between the OP's proposal and the present.

Ifrit sometimes drops his horns, horns are untradeable, can be exchanged at an NPC for weapon of choice.

Requires that you be in the party to complete the fight.
Removes the crafter, HQ, materia possibility out of the equation.
Removes the current loot system fury for Ifrit weapons out of the equation.
Carries Yoshi-P's desire that you could get a weapon from a class you weren't playing with and the drop is still random.

And now the part that will cause even more conflict:
Should the horns be unique to encourage party breaking or sheer altruism (you got horns, party wants to rerun, because they didn't get horns)?

[wind]

They better not lock us into it though, I at least want the level of options we had at launch. I want to be able to pass items, if I can do at least that frankly I am happy because then we can deal with loot ourselves, as a linkshell.

I saw you say this in multiple posts implying you can not pass with a "need or greed" system. You do realize you can right? There is a little red x that you click which passes :P.

Not to mention you keep bringing up WoW, which their system of need or greed was only applicable for there Dungeon Finder. Any Guild with half a brain distributed Loot via Master.. which was usually a leader or GM that would look at the DKP and determine who deserved it, bold'd that for you since you like using that word .

Even if they didn't port over Master Loot, which I don't see why they wouldn't, the LS leader can just force people to pass to the person who greeds(if their not on the right class, and if the system truly does restrict them). Not rocket science to figure out you still have control over where the loot goes. And since your LS is "perfect" all your members shouldn't ninja loot and quietly pass since they all love you for some reason.

Regardless I'm pretty sure you're just against Need or Greed since it was in WoW, and for w/e reason FF fans(which i played XI for yeaaaars before playing wow) treat WoW like it molested them when they were younger or something. It confuses me how crazy some people get on an emotional level when they have the WoW v FF fight.

Anyways proceed with your fight I mean argument..