Job Stances

[Archamgel]

Anytime I am stance dancing it makes me miss my FFXI Sch a bit. They were a very complex class and fun/rewarding.

Then, I was thinking about more skills that could happen in future xpacs, and thought of this:

We could get different stances. These stances, once activated, would change out our current Job skills for others.

Sch could get Dark and Light Arts. Dark Arts being treated like Cleric Stance for Mind/Int swap get damaging/enfeebling skills. White Arts could grant us regens/buffs. Of course, switching stances should have a cool down of some sort so you have to tactically choose.

DK\\'s could get a stance with ranged Dmg/enfeeble. Pallys could get a heal/support one.

Others, Idk it would work well with. But, this system could potentially have 2 benefits:
1. More ways to play a job rather than just one "right" way.
2. Since the stances would replace job skills, it would save from "skill bloat" by giving us more, but not overflowing our hotbars.

[Nyghtmarerobu]

2. Since the stances would replace job skills, it would save from "skill bloat" by giving us more, but not overflowing our hotbars.

You're idea is sound, but as it stands, changing stances doesn't change your button layout, so it would just make the button layout even worse. Currently the only way to mess this is, through macros that change buttons, much like I use on my warrior. Whenever you press the stance button, the slots that I have assigned to Steel Cyclone and Inner beast change when I press Defiance, and if I press deliverance, those 2 same buttons shift to Fell Cleave and Decimate.

On a related note, I don't want to see every class have stances to switch. Diversity is a huge problem with the jobs/classes as they are now, but giving them all stance dancing doesn't fix the problem and doesn't really make the class any more complex, more so than it is really about the timing of using the switchs.

[Reynhart]

You're idea is sound, but as it stands, changing stances doesn't change your button layout, so it would just make the button layout even worse.

They could fix that without using macros. After all, the pet bar changes depending on the creature you summon.
For WAR, you could "fuse" Fell Cleave and Inner Beast. At level 54, instead of learning Fell Cleave, you could have gained a trait that transforms Inner Beast into a 500 potency attack while in Deliverance.

[Caitlyn]

On a related note, I don't want to see every class have stances to switch. Diversity is a huge problem with the jobs/classes as they are now, but giving them all stance dancing doesn't fix the problem and doesn't really make the class any more complex, more so than it is really about the timing of using the switchs.

Its the same problem that any class got their DoTs, damage-buffs and selfheals (except MCH). And yes, nearly any class got their own stances. While its nice to switch between different stances for specific situations, it just feels like playing the same class with some slight modifications:



Or to make it simple: You place your DoTs and watch your buffs/stacks/DoTs, while doing your rotation and dodging AoEs. Renew your DoTs/buffs/stacks and repeat. I m looking forward for 4.0. I hope they made some drastic changes here.

[Nyghtmarerobu]

They could fix that without using macros. After all, the pet bar changes depending on the creature you summon.
For WAR, you could "fuse" Fell Cleave and Inner Beast. At level 54, instead of learning Fell Cleave, you could have gained a trait that transforms Inner Beast into a 500 potency attack while in Deliverance.

I feel like if this was possible, they'd have already done it, but instead we got the Double X Hot Bar to help with skill bloat coming with the next expansion.

[ADVSS]

Love the Souleater(kinda) lol

[Shurrikhan]

I feel like if this was possible, they'd have already done it, but instead we got the Double X Hot Bar to help with skill bloat coming with the next expansion.

There's a lot they could do that they haven't. Fusing mutually exclusive abilities into a single slot/bind is just the simplest of them. A more extreme example:

• Different hotbars for targeting an enemy vs. targeting an ally
• Different stance bars (e.g. for Cleric vs. regular).
• Attack spells on an ally automatically targeting (1) their target, (2) the enemy within x yards (based on target ally role) with the most allies attacking it, or (3) any non-CCed enemy attacking the ally
• Healing spells on an enemy can be key-modified to, user configured to, or automatically heal the (1) the lesser %HP of self or target of target, given anticipated HP loss from any attacks the enemy is casting against the target with less time until completion than your healing ability, (2) enemy's target - always -, or (3) self - always.

The result would be that you essentially need ~7 fewer binds on any given Healer (DoTs, directs, AoE, heavy), OR there's no need to target swap about with FT and ToT.

On Topic:

1. More ways to play a job rather than just one "right" way.
2. Since the stances would replace job skills, it would save from "skill bloat" by giving us more, but not overflowing our hotbars.

1. This is a GREAT goal, in my opinion, but stances aren't necessary to get the results your looking for, and making stances the means to such for all jobs will likely make them feel even more homogenized than they do now.

2. Note that stances also require a button, and using them as a means to deffer button-bloat will cost immediate access to certain (especially -now- cross-stanced) skill functionality, likely making things feel more clunky and packaged, especially where these skills affect the skill functions we already have, and are used to having (near-) immediate access to. In the end, that's what button-bloat comes down to: points of manual control. Combating button-bloat then comes down to (1) investing more significance and points of interest (altogether, general attractiveness) into each bind or their combined button-flows through ability rework, and (2) finding intuitive ways to package the various capabilities of a given class into maximal access with the least total keys needed -- e.g. the least feeling of control loss, hopefully with the benefit of increased intuitiveness, fewer obligatory and uninteresting key presses, and improved button-flow. Stances are just one of many, many packaging methods; the skills themselves, depending on their buffs, can actually be yet another, for instance, while revamping skills to use shared resources which can be manipulated in a variety of ways (one manipulation abilities taking the job of multiple direct or utility abilities), or their means of casting (e.g. Fire I, II, or III determined by cast length, or automatically using the currently positioned Opo-opo, Raptor, or Coeurl skill) are yet more such methods.

I honestly think its best solutions may eventually come down to the user interface side, where the same capabilities may be given through 13 total keys or 35, as per user preference, with the prior about as precise and reliable in most situations as the latter, rather than universally modifying the specs themselves. I don't see why one person should have to play with the same abilities on screen as I do, as long as their Monk still has the same total and accessible functionality as mine, etc. I honestly don't care if one person's experience looks more like XIII while mine looks more traditional as long as the prior doesn't sacrifice too much ready detail of control for its more hands-off or "cinematic" feel, as to create two different levels of players. Multiple ways of play, in the game and unto the game, all viable.

[Reynhart]

I feel like if this was possible, they'd have already done it, but instead we got the Double X Hot Bar to help with skill bloat coming with the next expansion.

It is possible. Just look at Equilibrium.

[Nyghtmarerobu]

It is possible. Just look at Equilibrium.

The differance between Equilibrium and other things that are being asked for, is that it does 2 different effects based on the stance you're in, rather than having 2 different abilitys and having them switch places on the hotbar based on your stance.

[Reynhart]

The differance between Equilibrium and other things that are being asked for, is that it does 2 different effects based on the stance you're in, rather than having 2 different abilitys and having them switch places on the hotbar based on your stance.

Just like Inner Beast could do 300 potency and 100% leech under Defiance and 500 potency under Deliverance.