Scaling of abilities to a player's level is not a step in the right direction.

[Inaaca]

You must not have common sense breh. Imma let you see when the patch goes live how wrong you arez

Eh? It doesn't take common sense read the facts that Yoshi has stated. Class fundamentals will stay the same.

Around half of Gridania's quests heavily involve Conjurers, the elements, and the elementals. The guild itself defines Conjurers as extensions of the elements through an individual. If that's not fundamental, I dunno what is. SE isn't going to rewrite half the lore and quest events in order to facilitate a change like that.

In the same way, the fundamentals of Thaumaturges are the fact that they deal with light and dark.

[Spellbinder]

You must not have common sense breh. Imma let you see when the patch goes live how wrong you arez

Well please don't hesitate to enlighten me Manafont. Could you explain to me what are considered to be the fundamental elements of the Conjurer class that the Developers explicitly stated are not being changed?

[Engineer]

So I've heard/read that SE is planning to eliminate tiered abilities and instead have one spell/ability that becomes more powerful as a character becomes higher level. This simply will not work.

This is going to put players in a position where hate control is going to become a huge issue. As a level 50 Conjurer this tells me that I will have 1 Cure spell, for example, that becomes more powerful as I level. This is all well and good until you consider the fact that if I want to drop a Cure I or Cure II on the tank or DD that needs said Cure, and hate has not been well established, I'm going to have only one, what I assume to be tier III powered Cure, available to me to use to cure the tank/dd.

If hate has not been well established this is going to cause me to become the mob's primary target as the enmity generated from the tier III powered Cure spell I used is going to cause the mob to see me as a threat.

This works the same way with attack magic. If I want to DD as Con, rather than dropping tier III spells before hate has been well established I will no longer have the option of being able to use a tier 1 or tier 2 level attack magic spell. This again will generate enmity that could very well cause me to pull the mob off of the tank and put me at risk of being an mp sponge.

I, for one, am none too please with SE's or Yoshi P's decision to go in this direction as I enjoy playing strategically and being able to use the different tiered spells I have available to me not only just to make sure I don't generate too much enmity and pull hate off the tank, but also because the use of lowered tiered spells in instances where they would be suitable conserves mp.

I would much prefer to have the option of using a lowered tiered spell to save mp and make sure that I am not generating too much enmity than have only one spell/ability that has been scaled to my level as far as it's potency is concerned.

It is probably already too late for my concerns to make a difference but I did want to start this thread to see if there are any other players out there who share the same concern that I have with tiered spells being eliminated.

I could go on and on in regards to the problems with this new system that is to be implemented, but I think I have made my point. In closing, SE please think before you take action and change a perfectly good system into what you "think" will be more suitable. These types of changes should absolutely have to be rigorously tested in various situations including xp parties, instanced dungeons, and fights such as the Ifrit battle before they are ever considered for actual placement and use in game. I'm going to be none to pleased when I'm being eaten by mobs because I dropped a "Cure" on a tank/DD and it causes me to draw hate because my spell was scaled to my level and the potency caused the mob to see me as a threat. Also, and I know I have already mentioned this, this is going to cause a lot of trouble for us mages when it comes to conserving mp.

Share your feedback. Maybe my opinion is not necessarily correct and everything will work out beautifully, but I highly doubt it will, unless we are given the option to choose the potency of the 1 spell available for us to use which has been scaled to be as potent as it should be at a player's level.

I actually like the new system. To me its a relief, in the sense that i dont have to carry all the tier spells. We have always swapped the old one for the new one as we progressed, so i look at it like SE is doing us a favor.

Looking at iit in the prospective of emnity gain from nuking is pretty promising. SE built a combo system, and im sure that includes casters. All we have to do is spirit dart the enemy inbetween nukes to save mp , and to not bbuild up too much Hate.

SE already has mentioned that emnity gain from Healing is going to be significantly reduced.

And who knows, there might be a way to cast a magic before its fully charged to gain the tier 1 effect.

[Physic]

Hmm. . . CNJ abilities (pulled out of my arse).

1. Wall (there's Protect and Shell together)
2. Stoneskin
3. Cure
4. Esuna
5. Holy (astral DD spell)
6. . . .Un-holy? (Umbral DD spell)
7. Soughspeak
8. Raise
9. Sleep
10. . . .

So, yeah, maybe I'm missing something, but that seems to cover the essentials. . .

(wall is a good idea btw)

this wouldnt be bad, if it was whm only, but look at what you go there, they dont have a damge spell or ability till their 5th skill, which according to their chart is level 10

so basically at level 13, they got 5 abilities, 2 cross class abilities. and you havent even included big boys like profundity, spiritsong, etc.
imagine trying to level up conjurer without a dmg spell or even a tp move till level 10. that would be super boring.

[Viridiana]

I'd guess you're missing the spells that make Conjurer, you know, an Elementalist? Conjurer is not the White Mage, White Mage is...

I have a bad feeling reducing it down to only 15 spells is going to be a problem.

Okay, remove the astral/umbral spells an add in one for each element. That's only 13 spells. What are the other two, and what's the next one that puts you at 16/15?

[Physic]

Different dev team, Yoshi wasn't in charge.

Chances are the new moogle fight has been tuned with the skill changes in effect, they have a test server obviously, I can't see something like enmity going unoticed.

considering they only finished the outline that yoshiP didnt approve officially, last week, and yoshi p just approved it like wednesday, i highly doubt they have tested anything at all, especially against moogle battle. maybe by late december they will have, but we ll see.

[Viridiana]

(wall is a good idea btw)

this wouldnt be bad, if it was whm only, but look at what you go there, they dont have a damge spell or ability till their 5th skill, which according to their chart is level 10

so basically at level 13, they got 5 abilities, 2 cross class abilities. and you havent even included big boys like profundity, spiritsong, etc.
imagine trying to level up conjurer without a dmg spell or even a tp move till level 10. that would be super boring.

They don't have a damage spell? You either skipped or misunderstood numbers 5 and 6. Also, I totally meant to add a line saying that those were in no particular order. >_>

There's still room, even under my revised list of splitting out the elements, for Spiritsong and Profundity (though, I honestly wouldn't be surprised if Profundity were subsumed into the combo system).

[Manafont]

Well please don't hesitate to enlighten me Manafont. Could you explain to me what are considered to be the fundamental elements of the Conjurer class that the Developers explicitly stated are not being changed?

first our castbar isn't going to get changed. case we need dat so we can know when our spellz are supposed to go off but aren't. We gonna still be dartin people for 10 dmgez cause dats what we need to use our tp movez from oder classes

[Bearforce]

So I've heard/read that SE is planning to eliminate tiered abilities and instead have one spell/ability that becomes more powerful as a character becomes higher level. This simply will not work.

This is going to put players in a position where hate control is going to become a huge issue. As a level 50 Conjurer this tells me that I will have 1 Cure spell, for example, that becomes more powerful as I level. This is all well and good until you consider the fact that if I want to drop a Cure I or Cure II on the tank or DD that needs said Cure, and hate has not been well established, I'm going to have only one, what I assume to be tier III powered Cure, available to me to use to cure the tank/dd.

If hate has not been well established this is going to cause me to become the mob's primary target as the enmity generated from the tier III powered Cure spell I used is going to cause the mob to see me as a threat.

This works the same way with attack magic. If I want to DD as Con, rather than dropping tier III spells before hate has been well established I will no longer have the option of being able to use a tier 1 or tier 2 level attack magic spell. This again will generate enmity that could very well cause me to pull the mob off of the tank and put me at risk of being an mp sponge.

I, for one, am none too please with SE's or Yoshi P's decision to go in this direction as I enjoy playing strategically and being able to use the different tiered spells I have available to me not only just to make sure I don't generate too much enmity and pull hate off the tank, but also because the use of lowered tiered spells in instances where they would be suitable conserves mp.

I would much prefer to have the option of using a lowered tiered spell to save mp and make sure that I am not generating too much enmity than have only one spell/ability that has been scaled to my level as far as it's potency is concerned.

It is probably already too late for my concerns to make a difference but I did want to start this thread to see if there are any other players out there who share the same concern that I have with tiered spells being eliminated.

I could go on and on in regards to the problems with this new system that is to be implemented, but I think I have made my point. In closing, SE please think before you take action and change a perfectly good system into what you "think" will be more suitable. These types of changes should absolutely have to be rigorously tested in various situations including xp parties, instanced dungeons, and fights such as the Ifrit battle before they are ever considered for actual placement and use in game. I'm going to be none to pleased when I'm being eaten by mobs because I dropped a "Cure" on a tank/DD and it causes me to draw hate because my spell was scaled to my level and the potency caused the mob to see me as a threat. Also, and I know I have already mentioned this, this is going to cause a lot of trouble for us mages when it comes to conserving mp.

Share your feedback. Maybe my opinion is not necessarily correct and everything will work out beautifully, but I highly doubt it will, unless we are given the option to choose the potency of the 1 spell available for us to use which has been scaled to be as potent as it should be at a player's level.

a wall of *haters gonna hate* text.

[zaviermhigo]

As of right now I'm okay with the scaling of potency, but I still have my concerns, will mp cost be the same? If so will we have less mp? Because it would seem sort of OP to be able to cast a cure for 8 mp and have it cure for 800hp at level 50, while still costing 8 mp. If the mp does increase as potency increases wouldn't this be problematic for the UI, or would there be a preset level 1-10 cure costs 8, and level 11-20 cure cost 12, and such. The choice to use the lower tier is now completely gone, does this mean hate will be rebalanced around this, I think it should be, because if not, the enmity minus gear on my belt won't be enough to keep me pulling hate from curing, I might have to go fetch some of those stronghold pieces like the head :/