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  1. #1
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    Quote Originally Posted by indira View Post
    and to make you grind gear doing the same crap over and over again
    And this is different from open world content, how? You don't have to like instanced content, but at least use legitimate complaints when whining about it.
    (2)

  2. #2
    Player HiirNoivl's Avatar
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    Mar 2011
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    Character
    Hiir Noivl
    World
    Mateus
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    Marauder Lv 50
    Because instanced content is much more flexible to work with and can more easily provide fun than open world.
    This... I'm learning quickly about the extreme limitations of this open world concept. It was nice to try it out... but in the end it was just too inflexible. Because of seamless transition, I can't tell North Shroud from South in a screen shot.

    With more instanced areas we can start making some really unique places.
    (2)

  3. #3
    Player
    Betelgeuzah's Avatar
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    Mar 2011
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    Character
    Captain Lalafist
    World
    Odin
    Main Class
    Arcanist Lv 82
    It all comes down to balance. Designers are humans, and they, too, have their limitations. Balance is much easier to pull off when you have control over the variables such as party set-up, size, possible skill set-ups.

    Freedom is the complete opposite of balance. Freedom, to designers, means more variables, to the point where they are impossible to control. That only applies from a gameplay perspective though. Aesthetical freedom is only a strain on the art assets.

    Freedom vs. Balance is what MMO devs struggle with. On the other hand you have the concept of an MMO, on the other hand you want to create a game with balanced=>tactical=>challenging=>meaningful gameplay. At the end of the day, either extreme is never the answer.

    While I wouldn't want SE to go to such extremes as WoW does with it's search for Perfect Balance I want them to be close enough for XIV to feel like an actual game. For that to happen the designers need to be in control.
    (4)

  4. #4
    Player
    Forbin's Avatar
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    Jul 2011
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    Character
    Fufanu Nakamoto
    World
    Faerie
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    Marauder Lv 41
    dungeon finder will spell the end of FFXIV... THAT IS NOT AN MMO! why are all companies going to this crap.
    (8)

  5. #5
    Player
    Sephrick's Avatar
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    Mar 2011
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    Character
    Sephrick Markarius
    World
    Excalibur
    Main Class
    Gladiator Lv 70
    Quote Originally Posted by Forbin View Post
    dungeon finder will spell the end of FFXIV... THAT IS NOT AN MMO! why are all companies going to this crap.
    Someone has yet to illustrate the difference between a dungeon finder and waiting while your party leader /shouts in town to manually form a party. If the system is faulty, it won't be used. XI had an auto-group function and it was ignored in favor of just building linkshells for regular events.

    Just because there's a dungeon finder doesn't mean anyone will be forced to use it. It's the sort of thing that will be a godsend for smaller groups but the lot of us will be unaffected.
    (1)

  6. #6
    Player
    Sephrick's Avatar
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    Mar 2011
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    Character
    Sephrick Markarius
    World
    Excalibur
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    Gladiator Lv 70
    it's a matter of perspective, XI wasn't about "Claiming" your content people really blow this out of proportion. We had tons of open world content.

    Campaign, Fields of Valor, Beastmen forts, Open Dungeons, vast world filled with lore and content.
    Yeah, all the endgame linkshells were really planning their week around Fields of Valor and coffer key runs.

    XI was 100% about being the one to get claim. The fights were boring. Ifrit is 1,000 times more fun than anything in XI ever was.
    (1)

  7. #7
    Player

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    Mar 2011
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sephrick View Post
    Yeah, all the endgame linkshells were really planning their week around Fields of Valor and coffer key runs.

    XI was 100% about being the one to get claim. The fights were boring. Ifrit is 1,000 times more fun than anything in XI ever was.

    LoL you must not have done much of anything if you say Ifrit is way more fun than anything else in FFXI.... in my eyes every aspect of SEA was way more fun than ifrit.... including just soloing the mobs there and walking through the zone.
    I mean if all you did was party level then yea im sure ifrit is the most fun you've had in a FF MMO
    (5)
    <a href="http://www.ffxivorigin.com/tools/signature/"><img src="http://sigs.enjin.com/sig-ffxiv/33226_e492ed927ed5e48d.png"></a>

  8. #8
    Player
    Sephrick's Avatar
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    Mar 2011
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    1,900
    Character
    Sephrick Markarius
    World
    Excalibur
    Main Class
    Gladiator Lv 70
    You act like instanced content is free of flaws.
    Not saying it's not flawed at all. Just saying it's leaps and bounds better than XI's endgame system. Even the instanced stuff wasn't instanced. It was just areas you could lock others out of.

    Staring at my screen for 3+ hours hoping my group got claim just for the chance to roll the RNG dice to see if the crao drop rates actually were in our favor just sucked out loud.


    Want to lowman the new dungeon? Too bad you "Require" more members than you have. Shout for members on your server? Please nobody wants to play with people on the same server. Want to try any open-world content with strangers? That's a shame everyone else is qued up for instanced content and wants cross server players they will never see again.
    I'll agree the minimum restrictions are silly for entrance. But this dungeon finder thing is being blown way out of proportion. It's really a self-defeating argument because:

    A) It will be successful, everyone will use it and will get to run the content of their choosing.

    or

    B) It will fail, no one will use it and we'll go back to shouting like we always have.

    If the issue is not being able to find the same folks again, it can easily be suggested to allow a cross-server invite system through the dungeon finder.
    (1)

  9. #9
    Player Jynx's Avatar
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    Mar 2011
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    4,964
    Character
    Jynx Masamune
    World
    Diabolos
    Main Class
    Thaumaturge Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Sephrick View Post
    Yeah, all the endgame linkshells were really planning their week around Fields of Valor and coffer key runs.
    Yeah all the endgame linkshells were watching Vtra on a 72 hour basis amiright guys?

    Not everyone participated in the stuff you claim to be 100% of FFXI.

    Assault, Besieged, Campaign, ENM, ZNM, BCNM, Dreamworld Dynamis, Limbus, Sea, Quests, Leveling, none of these overtly focuses on "Claiming your content" Stop with your hyperbole. XI had tons of content outside instances that was worth doing and hardly ever as competeted for as you make it out to be.

    A few NM's being overcamped for marginally better gear? Sure it happened, we also had a amazing community from it to an extent. Not everything is going to be sunshine and rainbows even with all instanced content I can assure you that. Hell I bet when the next FF-online comes out there will be people like you bashing how XIV did things like people do with XI. It's an enigma wrapped in a puzzle layered over a conundrum how people have such selective minds when they want too.

    I don't deny XI had it's share of issues and the 72 hour NM's were one of them but for the most part those utterly DISSAPEARED when they released new content, it's not SE's fault that people continue to obsess over content from the game during its early years.

    The thing XI did was give you such a amazing expansion of option to do, with the level cap being 75 for so long the ammount of gear you could wear was astounding, just because some people obsessed over abjuration gear when there were hundreds of other viable options to them isn't SE's problem they weren't going to break game balance just to get people to come off of HNM's. Abysea did that, now it's all instanced and boring as hell.

    Want to get anywhere in XI nowdays? Abysea runs!

    Quote Originally Posted by Sephrick View Post
    But this dungeon finder thing is being blown way out of proportion. It's really a self-defeating argument because:

    A) It will be successful, everyone will use it and will get to run the content of their choosing.

    or

    B) It will fail, no one will use it and we'll go back to shouting like we always have.
    This is the great thing about talking these issues out, because I have a vastly different idea than what you have about how the Dungeon finder can mess things up. I'm willing to support the devs and give it a shot when it comes out, but as it stands with the limited information we have available I am going to tell them why I think it's a bad idea.

    A: It will be sucsesfull and playing on a server has absolutly no meaning anymore, economy will be either shot due to making dungeon loot rare/ex or flucuate insanely due to loot drops from cross server content mucking things up.

    B: It will fail and SE will continue to push it because they spent alot of time/money on a system nobody wants to use, leaving people who want open world content in the dust.

    It's hard to not imagine SE focusing heavily on instanced content with such a large endeavor to make cross server play possible and feasable. I think it's wasted time and effort I don't see many people screaming for darkhold or ifirit runs as it stands the entry requirement are nowhere near as harsh as XI was so finding a group of people on your own damn server hasn't been much of a challenge...why waste the time and money when it's not even a issue?
    (5)
    Last edited by Jynx; 11-13-2011 at 05:35 AM.

  10. #10
    Player
    Xianghua's Avatar
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    Jul 2011
    Location
    Limsa
    Posts
    405
    Character
    Fiona Valencia
    World
    Excalibur
    Main Class
    Thaumaturge Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by Jynx View Post
    Yeah all the endgame linkshells were watching Vtra on a 72 hour basis amiright guys?

    Not everyone participated in the stuff you claim to be 100% of FFXI.
    Because Vrtra had nothing good to go after to even bother camping. people went after him because they were bored.

    Assault, Besieged, Campaign, ENM, ZNM, BCNM, Dreamworld Dynamis, Limbus, Sea, Quests, Leveling, none of these overtly focuses on "Claiming your content" Stop with your hyperbole. XI had tons of content outside instances that was worth doing and hardly ever as competeted for as you make it out to be.
    Assault, ENM, BCNM, ZNM(bosses). dynamis, Limbus - instanced



    The thing XI did was give you such a amazing expansion of option to do, with the level cap being 75 for so long the ammount of gear you could wear was astounding, just because some people obsessed over abjuration gear when there were hundreds of other viable options to them isn't SE's problem they weren't going to break game balance just to get people to come off of HNM's. Abysea did that, now it's all instanced and boring as hell.
    comparing a game with its expansions to one that has none kinda pointless.

    Want to get anywhere in XI nowdays? Abysea runs!
    Abyssea is actually open world simply because everyone is together in the same zones. and you complain about it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jynx View Post
    I don't even know where to start...this statement is wrong in so many ways.
    Yes it basically is simply because with open world you always have the Chance to do said content. because its open to all
    2 groups already there? will to bad for you there goes your plans for the night. however with instance you always get to do what you want. 6 groups doing darkhold? that's fine you still can go and and get the event done have fun. You say its not claim game but it is. no matter how you do it. if the event is open to everyone. you will always have a chance just to do the event.

    Once again most of XI's content was Instanced. the only time XI became more focused on open world content was get ready. ABYSSEA! Abyssea was the 1st time you can get all your gear from open world. it completely killed off everything else. Every other place in the game because 100% useless. you were either in Jeuno or abyssea.
    (0)

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