Yoshi-P on Character Growth

[HungryHippo]

Well yes since you're marking all languages it won't affect you, but my point was that since you're on the EU data center which has a large French population that queuing with F would reduce queue time instead of only queuing E.

But since you are queuing with everything I can't really offer anything other than my condolences for your queue time troubles.;; (๑•́ㅿ•̀๑)

No worries, like I said, people been far nice and actually give me a nice respons without harrasing me, which I appreciate, I'm just wondering how long they wanna keep doing this.

[SessionZero]

World of Warcraft makes several changes over the course of it's lifetime, players complain and reminisce with nostalgia glasses and make private servers to relive the "glory days."

FFXIV announces that it'll more or less stay the course with minor adjustments to it's formula, players complain that it's stagnant and boring and needs major overhauls in order to retain subscription numbers.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Khemorex]

No, they don't but it's an MMO. People need to learn to be a little more patient. It's a marathon not a sprint. You can't complain about every queue that doesn't pop, get 3-7 other friends to play if you need to be able to do things all the time every time on your schedule.

what he sayed , that is just the nature of the game sometime u wait 1 sec sometimes u wait 10-30 min , i just did sastasha as dps had to wait 12 min @ 10pm CET

had 2 new people in it to

while u can progress normaly with the main scenario (via rouletes and relic weapon :P),
the only thing where u might not find a group (in a normal mmo time) via duty finder is coil , because its not a main scenario quest,and the gear is outdated anyway.

[Kallera]

It's already guaranteed to be different, just with PoTD and that infrastructure in the mix.

I'm also betting we'll see a new Diadem-type of content, but probably designed to be much more engaging than the initial attempt. Yoshi seems pretty intent on developing new kinds of content to go along with what we've grown accustomed to.

Not at the same time, and likely not as activities to replace the grind at endgame. remember how 3.0 somehow had less going on than 2.55? It will be like that.

[thorkellthetall]

If 4.x is more of the same, it will damage the game more than 3.1 did. They have to do something interesting.

[Thayos]

If 4.x is more of the same, it will damage the game more than 3.1 did. They have to do something interesting.

It's already guaranteed to be different, just with PoTD and that infrastructure in the mix.

I'm also betting we'll see a new Diadem-type of content, but probably designed to be much more engaging than the initial attempt. Yoshi seems pretty intent on developing new kinds of content to go along with what we've grown accustomed to.

[Kaurie]

It's already guaranteed to be different, just with PoTD and that infrastructure in the mix.


I'm also betting we'll see a new Diadem-type of content, but probably designed to be much more engaging than the initial attempt. Yoshi seems pretty intent on developing new kinds of content to go along with what we've grown accustomed to.

I think this is the issue right here. When we use generic comments like "guaranteed to be different" and "more of the same", there is a massive difference in what each of us are interpreting. I for one, do not consider PotD to be core to the game enough that it makes the game guaranteed to be different. I am sure the person you quoted feels the same way, but I guess I cannot be 100%.

When I read, "If 4.x is more of the same, it will damage the game more than 3.1 did. They have to do something interesting.", I think fundamentals need to be changed. Things such as (not necessarily all, or any, of these - just examples):

• Reinvigorating combat and making changes to the current skill bloat, complexity and length GCD (lengthy GCD works well with the skill bloat and complexity that we have, but if we reduce the others, GCD needs to be addressed)
• Change how raids and/or dungeons are presented (i.e. not queuing straight into a boss for a raid, or non-linear pathway dungeons)
• Create more open world end-game focus
• A change to the trinity (4th role? More combined roles? Different content requires different roles?)
• Talent trees or specs added

Or more on point to the original poster's discussion - consistent growth of character post max level. This can be done in numerous ways (i.e. look at Artifact weapons in WoW).

[Bourne_Endeavor]

Or more on point to the original poster's discussion - consistent growth of character post max level. This can be done in numerous ways (i.e. look at Artifact weapons in WoW).

Not necessarily. Now that Legion is moving beyond the honeymoon phase, people are starting to complain about the Artifact weapons because they become a massively long grind. FFXIV tried this and people did nothing but whine over the Anima weapon. Granted, my own complaints were it lacked any meaningful sense of progression. You just did chores.

I, initially, supported a fourth role, but now wonder if that would only take away from existing job diversity. Say a dedicated Support role was added. Dragoon having the raid utility it does would no longer make sense, since those buffs should be on a Support job. We essentially already have a fourth role when you consider just have versatile Ninjas, Bards and Machinists are.

[Kaurie]

Not necessarily. Now that Legion is moving beyond the honeymoon phase, people are starting to complain about the Artifact weapons because they become a massively long grind. FFXIV tried this and people did nothing but whine over the Anima weapon. Granted, my own complaints were it lacked any meaningful sense of progression. You just did chores.

I, initially, supported a fourth role, but now wonder if that would only take away from existing job diversity. Say a dedicated Support role was added. Dragoon having the raid utility it does would no longer make sense, since those buffs should be on a Support job. We essentially already have a fourth role when you consider just have versatile Ninjas, Bards and Machinists are.

Whether people complain about them or not is irrelevant. I did not say it was good or bad (while I think they are good, that wasn't explicitly said). All I said is that it is a form of post-max level progression.

That said, I have seen very few people complaining about them in-game, on reddit or on their official forums. Most who have complained get a lot of downvotes.

Also, the relic and the artifact are really nothing alike. Comparing apples to oranges.

In terms of the 4th role, all current classes have some support and/or utility. These would need to be removed really in order for a Support/Utility role to be viable. There are other possibilities for a 4th role, I would think. We just need to be creative. The new content would obviously need to cater to these other roles.

Maybe there could be a leadership role - with skills to help your team flow more synergistically and provide on-screen direction.
Maybe there could be a crowd control role - which exclusively applies debuffs to enemies to help control the battlefield
Maybe there could be other roles that I cannot think of off the top of my head.

I think if a new role were added, all new jobs would need to be that role, so that we were not left with 1 job for 1 role.

Also note that I am not necessarily in favour of adding a new role.

[Brannigan]

Interesting stats and gear would fix character growth.

"Before I got X item I couldn't do Y" (where Y is not defeating a specific boss, but an actual thing your character can do - An extra hit during a buff window, a new rotation, etc)

something you'll never say in FFXIV.


By the way, interesting stats doesn't mean unique gear abilities or new stats necessarily. A new stat would help, but

-procs on crit
-procs on parry
-abilities that do more of something (damage reduction, duration, whatever) with higher DET/Speed
-more WSes like Empyreal Arrow
-chance to X on WS (benefits from speed)

would all make stats more interesting just by existing. The problem is that we have relatively bland classes + extremely bland gear combined with constant gear resets and catchup patches every 3 months. Raids give no rewards because even if you get a best in slot set and fully kit it out with materia, you have to replace it next raid patch with really easy to obtain crafted gear.