Seeking Confirmation about DRK

[Unittj]

So I wanted to post here to ask PvP aficionados who've had a better eye on patch notes and announcements more than I have regarding the PvP capacity of Dark Knight

Last night I queued into the Feast and had an extremely disgruntled Astrologian who made it their mission to spend the entirety of the match telling me that running Dark Knight was the worst PvP choice I made. They made the claim I cost the team the match for that choice, despite having had one match as the same class with 2 K/0 D/1 A, that being the highest score for the team. (not trying to say that's gloriously fantastic of a score or anything but I've won with DRK before)

The AST took the time out to spam in chat something about how DRK is terrible support, doesn't threaten the opposing heals, and primarily how Yoshida himself said it was a wrong class for PvP. They insisted that for me to choose that class even though there was some point stated it wasn't good before the current patch was such a terribad choice I should stop PvPing altogether.

So the purpose of the post is confirmation. Why is Dark Knight so bad? I usually don't suffer any deaths I find Carnal Chill and Tar Pit important debuffs because of the AoE capacity and quick cooldowns. Also, being able to use at least three defensive buffs with Push Back and Living Dead just to make it hard to get that kill and those medals a good strategy that's saved me more than once.

Where did Yoshida say it was bad, I'd love to be able to read that entry myself.

And I'd like to hear everyone else's experiences regarding DRK in PvP. I want to make sure the AST's salt was justified, and they weren't just pointlessly toxic.

Thank you for any advice/commentary on the matter.

[Chaelyn]

Tanks usually don't suffer deaths in Feast, usually 0-1 mainly cause you're not really worth focusing unless you have a fat stack of medals.

As far as DRK as a job in PvP. DRK lacks a lot compared to what the other 2 tanks have. You have Carnal Chill, great, doesn't last that long and most DRKs use it for damage or on the healer. You have VERY limited peeling potential for your team, you have Tar Pit and Carnal Chill. Compared to Warriors (Holmgang, AoE Stun, Thrill, Mantra, Storm's path, etc) and Paladin (Stun locks, Cover, Clemency, Pacify, etc). The only nice merit you get from DRK is a hefty amount of AoE damage, decent burst and you have double vulnerability with Full Swing and Sole Survivor.

DRK is the only tank I play in PvP and I mainly play it in Frontlines. But I'd say I have a decent enough amount of experience to be able to judge the class where it is currently. I'm gonna tell you right now, you have to be a pretty damn good DRK (or tank for that matter) to actually "carry" your team. Tanks have the least amount of carry potential in Feast.

Most people would say DRK pretty much says you have an 80% chance of losing the match just because of the stuff it doesn't offer that the other 2 tanks have. The buff in 3.4 may change that but we'll have to see.

[TiramisuMacaron]

DRK is in a much, much 'darker' place than PLD or WAR. In fact, there is only one DRK on all of Primal that I am happy to have on my team. The funny thing is it is his alt account, and on his main he is much more powerful on DRG/WAR/PLD than he is on DRK (not because of player skill, but because of class balance).

Utility:
Carnal Chill is a great PvP ability, DRK also has access to a stun, blinds, and slows, but it doesn't come close to negating burst or creating opening as much as PLDs tools (Shield Bash, Clem, Cover, Pacific, Silence, Divine Veil, Flash). Arguably, even the abilities WARs have make more of an impact (Holmgang, Tempest, Thrill of War, Path, Slashing Debuff). Minus the DRK mentioned above, I don't even see DRKs use Carnal Chill properly.
PLD >>>>> WAR >= DRK

Damage:
DRK is leaps and bounds behind WAR on damage. Dark Arts + Carve and Spit with oGCD spam doesn't even come close to Berserk + double Fell Cleave. Outside of WARs burst, every 6gcds they can use Fell Cleave to interrupt a cast. DRK also doesn't have access to slashing debuff, which gimps them just as much in PvP as it does in PvE. Yes, you have the extra 10% damage vulnerability ability, but it doesn't come close to making up for what it lacks.
WAR >>>>> DRK >> PLD

YoshiP said that DRK was getting a PvP buff in 3.4, but if it is just the buff he talked about (adding bind to the AoE enmity move), it isn't really enough to push them up to the level a WAR or PLD brings to the table.

So yea, DRK is on the bottom of the tanking slot totem pole. Now, I'm not 100% sure I agree with the AST that everyone has to play optimal classes though. If that were the case, every team would be WAR/SCH(WHM)/MNK(DRG)/BLM(MCH)...

(EDIT) I'm dumb and can't read. Saying you died was wrong, but I'll keep this here anyways:
You also mentioned you died, that's bad. I didn't watch the match, but I'm going to guess you didn't use your abilities and CDs properly or you had way more than 4 stacks of heavy medal. Even great gold tanks think they are invincible, they die by YOLOing or not turning on tank stance when people start hitting them. Don't be one of those tanks. The most you contribute to the match is you medal management and your awareness. MCH popped raging strikes? I can heavy swing their target for a for sure kill. Healer died? Let me stun the people chasing my melee or healer someone up. I have 4 stacks? Let me tell the team who should pick up the next medal. Also if you ever die without using LD (or HG), and purifying it before it wears off... It will make me very very very sad.

[ArianneMartellMateus]

Warrior and paladin can both hold 4 stacks of medals fairly safely, dark knight is easy to kill at 4 stacks of heavy medal and a huge burden to the healer if they get focused with 4 stacks. (not to mention warriors easy mode 2 hit kill, or paladins stun locking a healer as soon as they purify etc)

[TiramisuMacaron]

Warrior and paladin can both hold 4 stacks of medals fairly safely, dark knight is easy to kill at 4 stacks of heavy medal and a huge burden to the healer if they get focused with 4 stacks. (not to mention warriors easy mode 2 hit kill, or paladins stun locking a healer as soon as they purify etc)

elia come back :<

[Unittj]

All these responses are fantastic and well-thought out. Thank you for the pointers

[Februs]

YoshiP said that DRK was getting a PvP buff in 3.4, but if it is just the buff he talked about (adding bind to the AoE enmity move), it isn't really enough to push them up to the level a WAR or PLD brings to the table.

Hypothetically speaking, Drks could be used as an anit-tank tank after 3.4. As Pld, there is nothing more frustrating than getting hit with a bind just before, or just after, I hit a healer with a stun lock. I don't have as much experience with War, but I imagine it's much worse for them because they lack any way to break the bind by themselves (except for purify).

I don't know how viable that will make Drk on the whole, though. It will really fall to how efficient that bind is and what additional changes they make to the job or to CC in general.