Red Mage - The Spell Weaver

[Keyah]

Finished my concept and design for Red Mage yesterday.

I can't go into the specifics like I did in the write up as I am unable to put all of that here. So I will leave this link here for those that wish to read the full design.

I encourage you to read the full design, with abilities, actions, traits and imagery examples:

Keyah's Red Mage Concept Design


The Red Mage

RDM [DPS] (Because "Support" isn't a category)

• 4 low potency weaponskills to generate combos to aid their spells.
• Weapon enchantments to increase the damage done (Since Red Mage would scale from Intelligence).
• Weapon enchantment, Weaponskill rotations and DoT's
• Access to potent utility, enfeebling and enhancing magicks
• Cross-Class: Thaumaturge, Arcanist
• LB3: Phoenix Flame (low damage AoE + Resurrection)

More in the full article.

Hope you enjoy it. I would love to hear what you think.

[Spayd]

I'll admit i didnt read everything exhaustively, but what I've noticed that buggers me a lot is the amount of dots it would have. You classed 5 skills that applies dots with a total potency of 210 potency/tick if all of them are applied. For references, SMN have a total of 4 applyable dots: Bio, bio2, miasma and miasma 2. These 4 dots have a total of 115 potency/tick, thats only IF you apply Miasma 2. Otherwise its 95 potency/tick. That's considering the fact that SMN is a job that heavily relies on DoTs for good DPS. And after reading, I see that you have an option to turn your enchantement into a DoT, and if i understood well, it takes the potency of the enchantement, which is 80 for most of the case. So 290 potency/tick. For Reference, its almost a Aeolien Edge from ninja, every single tick, while being able to do regular weapon skills. That would just completely break the balance. Also a lot of actions with 350 potency, which is roughly below a Dragoon Full Thrust, even tho their casting time is long (3.50 seconds). Also, you talk about a lot of elemental damage in your RDM concept, but it is no secret that elemental damage changes absolutely nothing in this game, even Foe's requiem was changed to reduce magic defenses instead of elemental resists. So it is a lot of pointless actions for nothing imo.

From what I saw of your RDM concept, it is very unbalanced, broken, with a lot of impractical/useless skills. Plus a lot of the skills RDM have would be most of the time useless against raid bosses, unless for some rare cases.

Unless I didn't understand something, let me know, was still enjoyable to read, but it isnt made for this game, which is very well balanced if I dare say.

[Keyah]

Maybe should've prefaced saying this is an idea and not a completely finished and balanced work. I'm merely helping paint a picture of what I think it could be like.

The numbers are very general and you'll noticed that a lot of them (enfeebling particularly) have the same numbers. They're VERY unbalanced and in many situations completely broken. No TP or MP costs either because it's a balancing thing.

Maybe I'll go back and balance aspects.

This RDM concept is trying to deliver a Spell-Weaver. Utilizing of weapon-skills, DoT's, enchantments and enfeebling magic.

Red Mage's utility with master tier enfeebling would allow greater control over enemy states as well as being able to deal damage and buff the party. Brings a fair bit, maybe more than a Bard does if you think about it.

I mention it in the document but I would love for a "Support" category, because then it's right at home.

[Darkstride]

The En- spells are redundant since there are no elemental resistances that matter in combat. Having multiple ability slots for various elemental enchantments would serve no purpose, unless I missed so.e other job mechanic that would make use of individual elements separately.

[Keyah]

The En- spells are redundant since there are no elemental resistances that matter in combat.

The Enchantment spells are to provide INT scaling damage to your blade, such that you aren't reliant on weapon skill potency. It helps to bring justification to a spell-weaving system where you have reason to use both your sword and your magic. Elemental weaknesses are a thing, and if SE aren't going to use them appropriately, I will. If they aren't going to use them, remove them.

Red Mage's elemental sword hits would be exclusive damage from outwith. Applying En-Ice to the enemy won't make BLM's fire damage greater, otherwise there'd be no point for half of them. In a similar fashion to Ninja's Elemental wheel from FFXI, this is to provide an extra layer of potential damage (subtle, but enough) to keep RDM catching up with damage outwith DoT's while applying other utility throughout.

[Eloah]

okay after reading this i have to say I agree that the idea as it is now is a bit clunky, but you have the groundwork for a nice idea. Now i wouldn't say you need a major overhaul but this does need a lot more work to become a balanced job in the games current meta.

The first thing I will say that I think you did an awesome job doing is crafting the abilities in a listed and stylized manor, I can't even do that yet since I don't have the right programs... yet. Though I would suggest making the RDM symbol their iconic hat over a sword with flames, seems more fitting.

Secondly, the main thing to provide balance to the job is to keep things simple. Though, Yoshi-P said that he feels the HW rotations for each job are hard, they are quite simple to understand and execute, the only flaws are usually player error do to lag, time constraints, or controller vs Keyboard. DPS's and Tanks usually have a set rotation, or a standard one, that is flexible when the moment hits. Right now I see no "standard" rotation or excess abilities to be used as OGCD moves. Wanting the RDM to be primarily a spellweaver is fine but you have to make the skills/spells used have a main purpose. Sadly En-spells and debilitation abilities serve no purpose in this game in its current form. And, while I understand your reason for adding the En-spells the scaling with Int is usually build into a job, just look at DRK, a decent portion of their skills are spells. Also having 6 spells/skills that are basically the same thing is rather pointless, condensing them into one "En-spell" or ability, sounds like a better idea.

As for the combos you tries to create, having a "unique" branch as you currently have it seems okay, but i would recommend creating it similar to the mudra system where each finishing move has its own additional effect; adding too many effects can become confusing, especially if they are tied to main weapon skills. Plus you need to create a reason for the RDM to switch between using Magic or Melee attacks, push either a little too far in one direction and people will just spam that one set of skills, especially if they can augment them in other ways. The best suggestion I can give it is creating a job mechanic that encourages player to swap between the two like BLM does with Astral Fire and Umbral Ice. having a stacking mechanic that boosts the current arts power then allows for the use of a certain skill of the other art would encourage swapping. Start with a melee stance which increases str by 10% per stack, and once you gain, maybe 3 stacks, lets say a combo finish creates a stack, you can use a massive spell only available when you have those stacks, similar to warrior. Then once you use this spell it places you in mage stance, and the process repeats, build stacks by casting spells, then may chain or not, then once you have 3 again you use another skill and it places you in melee stance again. (this is my idea but feel free to use it in yours as well)

Hopefully everything that has been said encourages you to create the best RDM you can make, happy job-crafting, XD

[Keyah]

I tried more in the design, it was cluttered and didn't stand out.

I weep for the future if our Advanced Jobs stay as simple as they currently are.

you have to make the skills/spells used have a main purpose.

They do, weapon skills enhance spells if they are cast immediately after. Enchanting rotation, weakening enemy for more damage and longer DoTs.

Sadly En-spells and debilitation abilities serve no purpose in this game in its current form.

Look for what the game can be, not what it is.

i would recommend creating it similar to the mudra system where each finishing move has its own additional effect

Weapon skills already have unique effects.

you need to create a reason for the RDM to switch between using Magic or Melee attacks

Weapon skills enhance magic, magic enhances weapon skills.

[Eloah]

They do, weapon skills enhance spells if they are cast immediately after. Enchanting rotation, weakening enemy for more damage and longer DoTs.

while the enhancements are alright, they appear too complex, e.g. you need effect A to activate effect B, but you need to have Effect C up to use A but in order for B to work it must be used under effect D. Not saying this is your system, but it appears to come across this way. Additionally, double duration and double potency wind up being the same thing, if that was what you had for the "enhancements"

Look for what the game can be, not what it is.

it's not about what the game can be, it's about what the developers said they wouldn't add because it would create a large imbalance. There is no true elemental aspects because that would create an imbalance. So having 6 en-spells while admirable could be reduced to one skill/ability and open up 5 new skills/abilities/spells to use. as for debilitation spells, they work fine for crowd control but not on bosses since most are immune. I would recommend making them AoEs, that would make them more useful. Adding more spike skills would be better than all of the en-spells.

Weapon skills already have unique effects.

Yes they have a unique effect but you have too many. Remember that during a battle hiccups happen and you may not remember where you left off, how you started a combo, etc. While creating new and useful effects is a good thing, they shouldn't become confusing over time, remember people still confuse the mudras at times.

Weapon skills enhance magic, magic enhances weapon skills.

if this is true, you need to showcase it somehow, right now it just looks like they are ordinary spells, and similar to Healers the higher tiers will replace the older ones. The system looks clunky and not newbie friendly. Maybe give us an example of a rotation, the optimal one that players would probably find and use without end. if there is anything left over you may need to either rethink that skill or trim the fat entirely.

Also several of your spells are kinda odd if you pay attention to them.

Shell is not needed, it was added to Protect with a Conjurer trait in ARR, and made a default part of Protect with HW. Having the spell could be good but it can't be its usual iteration, since that serves no purpose in XIV.
Bar Astral & Bar Umbral, these spells could be good, but I don't know what they do, they just say they diminish astral/umbral detrimental effects, but what are these, you don't explain that.
Aquaveil, is it a permanent buff like Wanderer's Paean or Gauss Barrel to add additional damage, or is it a times buff like Enochian?
Gravity would need a name change, since AST already has the spell, maybe Demi instead. Additionally, spells, all spells, do not have "high" or "low" recasts they have high or low cast times so you might want to rethink some of your spells and their cast timers. the GCD is 2.5s and can be reduced with spell or skill speed.
Phalanx II being a spell with that high of a recast just makes no sense, if the recast is that high I'd make it an ability.

I hope none of this comes across as "mean" I am trying to help you flesh out your idea, but as of right now, and others have said it too, it appears a bit clunky and pulls too much from the XI RDM idea, which is fine, but XI played completely different and what worked there might not work in XIV.

Best of luck.

[Keyah]

Adding more spike skills would be better than all of the en-spells.

So why are you okay with different spike effects, but not a damaging rotation?
The "elemental weakness" aspect of the enchantment is purely for the en-spells.
It doesn't make other spells stronger.

The system looks clunky and not newbie friendly.

It's an advanced job, it's not supposed to be.

Shell stacks with protect providing more Magical protection, no Physical protection and enfeeble protection.
Bar Astral/Umbral are states (e.g. PLD Oath's) that act as an aura after 42 to protect against weaknesses
Aquaveil is a binary stance. Speed/Success
Gravity/Break have high cooldown because they deal AoE damage and hard CC. WAY too powerful to cast constantly.
Phalanx II is when you learn to cast it outwards to your party.

[Eloah]

So why are you okay with different spike effects, but not a damaging rotation?
The "elemental weakness" aspect of the enchantment is purely for the en-spells.
It doesn't make other spells stronger.

based on your description the spike spell you have listed, which is only the thunder element, appears to be a "buff" to a party member that adds a barrier around them that deals damage as a counter attack, similar to E4E or Vengence. more abilities like that are desirable, but adding too many could be redundant as well, so be careful.

It's an advanced job, it's not supposed to be.

An advanced job does not have to be complicated. Also, two things stand out to me now based on this statement and the statement you said in response to Xaikara PvP comments, "enfeebling masters". I cannot debate this, since I didn't play XI, and I defend the current Summoner iteration from those who claim "it's not a 'real' Summoner". But the primary aspect of a RDM is being a sturdy mage with access to both WHM and BLM spells, able to deal decent melee damage, and the main aspect, the ability to Dualcast. I'd say let these be the defining characteristics. You can still make them enfeeblers, but try not to place them on the same plain as XI's RDM.

Shell stacks with protect providing more Magical protection, no Physical protection and enfeeble protection.
Bar Astral/Umbral are states (e.g. PLD Oath's) that act as an aura after 42 to protect against weaknesses
Aquaveil is a binary stance. Speed/Success
Gravity/Break have high cooldown because they deal AoE damage and hard CC. WAY too powerful to cast constantly.
Phalanx II is when you learn to cast it outwards to your party.

If Shell is supposed to be additional magical protection then it should not be similar to Protect in from, it would work better as Stoneskin, or Manaward/Manawall (I forget which is magical at the moment)
if Bar Astral/Umbral are statuses, which is fine, what do they protect you from you still do not list that. Does Astral increase you physical defense and Umbral magical? Also if they are statuses, like SWD/SHD Oath shouldn't they be abilities?
With Aquaveil, I'm confused what you mean by "Binary Stance"
With Phalanx II, no skill/spell is like that, it's just an updated version of the previous. Why not just make both a spell then Phalanx is single target and Phalanx II is an AoE, with maybe a shorter duration but higher defense?

Thank you, I'm glad some people like the idea of a spell-weaving sword/caster.

remember that in some games RDM is either "upgraded" or given skills similar to Mystic/Rune Knight. Adding in a few of their usual/unique skills might help balance things out.