Thread: Classes and Rotations to be "Easier" in 4.0. Predictions, Concerns, and Discussion.

Originally Posted by Hustensaft

snip

Just playing devil's advocate here, but, DoTs do add at least as much depth as any other core attack, whatever their duration.

• They fill rotational space, and therefore are limited in where they can be placed within certain windows, and can often be pushed at cost of buff reapplication timings -- creating a point of decision, or compromise.
• They provide per-execute potency dynamics that depend on expected remaining seconds' of life on the target -- creating a point of foresight.
• None of them have natively enhanced enmity, and are all below the direct potency of non-DoTs -- creating a compromise between setup for enmity or immediacy of damage and enhanced dps.
• They allow for a second, more TP-efficient means of "AoE", DoT spreading -- this requires the player to consider his overall TP needs and resource, the total (per-execute) potency that can be inflicted by his AoEs, and the total (per-execute, including combo setup) potency that can be inflicted by each of his DoTs.

The only complexity any combo carries is due entirely to the windows caused by the player's DoTs and buffs.

Now let's take those last bits, e.g. Ruin III. Ruin II does not deal any more damage than Ruin I. It costs additional mana in order to free oGCD space and be used on the move; that is all. While the comparison between Ruin I and Boil is apt, the efficiency ratio is drastically different moving from Ruin I to Ruin III. Ruin III has far higher opportunity cost. Now, you could easily add mechanics to Ruin and Ruin II to allow for increased control of mana consumption for damage (altogether, output vs. efficiency) and perhaps even again give their maximum or near-maximum benefit for free while under DWT, but until that time, you are reducing complexity. You can mimic conventional use of Ruin III by, say, having Ruin I cost a % of current mana, and deal higher damage accordingly, but that still won't allow for maxing output before a combat-break, unloading on an enemy at all costs, or saving mana for a potential Swift-Ress.

The very idea of any buff or debuff is "do I have the time to make use of it" and "will it do what I need in time". Turn all that instead into passives, and the player makes no decisions. Hardware macro your way to victory.

That's not redacting until you find new ways to create points of decision. That's gutting.

Potency adjustments are easy. Retaining a playerbase who might enjoy challenge after trimming a huge portion of it from their personal rotations? Not so much.

Originally Posted by Hustensaft

EVERY Weaponskill that is not a combo-action should flat out be removed.

Or to put this quote another way: 'all weaponskills or buttons for them (with few exceptions) should be our combos.'

But do we really need so many buttons for our combos anyways?

Let's keep in mind how many actual actions we have. If you never choose not to complete a combo, then the only actual action you have is the finisher for that combo. That "combo" is no different from Fracture, Heavy Thrust, or Phlebotomize, except that it takes an additional 2 to 3 GCDs to go off.

On a level 50 Dragoon for instance that would give you four weaponskills — Chaos Thrust, Full Thrust, Heavy Thrust, and Phlebotomize; 6 core abilities — Leg Sweep, Power Surge, Jump, Spineshatter Dive, Dragonfire Dive, and Blood for Blood; and 3 auxiliary abilities — Invigorate, Keen Flurry, and Elusive Jump; and your 5 cross-class skills.
:: Heavy Thrust and Phlebotomize make up half your separate weaponskills, but only 9% of your total bindings at level 50 and 7.4% at level 60, or 25% of your weaponskill bindings at level 50, and 20% at level 60. 20% to 25% of the weaponskill button space makes up half your choices, while 8 slots at level 60 carry only one choice (do I start with Full Thrust or Chaos Thrust, and unless that mob is going to live for fewer than 5 GCDs, the answer will always be Chaos Thrust). Which set is the more efficient?

But, for now, let's go ahead and trim all non-combo weaponskills. That leaves your weaponskill total at 2 buttons on Dragoon, 3 on Monk, Paladin, and Dark Knight, 4 on Ninja (can be reduced to 3), and 5 on Warrior (can be reduced to 4).
At that point you wouldn't have to worry about button-bloat. Though you have specs that are simpler than the most pruned on WoW, and each combo use would make you feel like you have a GCD of 5 to 10 seconds.

Alternatively, you can keep the non-combo abilities AND reduce the buttons necessary to perform your combos, at which point you retain the same level of control, but need 3 to 7 fewer keys per job.

Some examples of reducing button bloat, including two perfect cases, and then the one I find messiest, reducing all to 3 buttons from an original 5 to 9 buttons.

Perfect Cases:
Dragoon - Two buttons, one per combo. F&C and WT combined and become same-slot positionally-defined skills.
Monk - Three buttons, rotating through stance. (1) Bootshine, (2) Dragon Kick, (3) AotD > (1) True Strike, (2) Twin Snakes, (3) 1IP > (1) Snap Punch, (2) Demolish, (3) Rockbreaker, player-rearrangeable.

Messy:
Ninja - 3 buttons. Starts as (1) Spinning Edge, (2) Mutilate, (3) Throwing Daggers.
On Spinning Edge: (1) Gust Slash, (2) Shadow Fang, (3) Throwing Daggers.
On Gust Slash: (1) Aeolian Edge, (2) Dancing Fang, (3) Armor Crush.