As a healer, is it my job to DPS? A new perspective.

[Awful]

That is really amazing. I dont kow how you manage that . Really its Wow

It's easy when you have the perfect comp, knowledgeable healers and tanks that contribute to the groups overall dps. The healers (specially xero) did more dps than pugs pre echo, well maybe not more but it's silly that the striking dummy boss can be cheesed very easily.

I haven't been on in 2 weeks due to irl stuff so I haven't touched creator savage with echo but it'll be super friggen faceroll with my static.

[Feyona]

It's easy when you have the perfect comp, knowledgeable healers and tanks that contribute to the groups overall dps. The healers (specially xero) did more dps than pugs pre echo, well maybe not more but it's silly that the striking dummy boss can be cheesed very easily.

I haven't been on in 2 weeks due to irl stuff so I haven't touched creator savage with echo but it'll be super friggen faceroll with my static.

Yes think your right and said so about teams needing to be ok as well to give the space . but most of the teams ive been in (random or learner) you arnt always able to. But see judge is 100 theres not many can do it not being negative cos think its brilliant

[Sebazy]

And there I was feeling happy about getting up to 60% dps whilst nigh solo healing A12s =(

Really nice work, striking dummy boss or no, it still hits pretty hard and I suspect it took a good bit of optimising to get both healers dpsing that hard for that long. Defo makes me a bit sad that my group doesn't want to do some speed runs as well =(

[bounddreamer]

I think a lot of the confusion and misunderstanding in this thread results in the switching back and forth between healer dps in casual content, to healer dps in savage content, and back again, and mixing the two. Especially since Feyona brought in her personal experience with learning savage content with a casual group. And there's been a lot of assumptions and more confusion stemming from that.

After a ton of back and forth I think, at last, I get where Feyona is coming from. A lot of people keep coming back in to stir the pot, though.

I think all of us can agree a healer shouldn't be required to dps if they're not comfortable. There's a variety of situations where this can happen: duty finder, party finders where you don't know the other healer or they're just not up for main healing, dungeons where you're new or returning, etc. And savage when someone is learning the fight and new to a group and maybe hasn't learned how best to synergize with their co-healer as well.

That doesn't mean there is no room for improvement or that a person is going to stay at that level in all situations.

When Dun Scaith first came out, I could never seem to fit in dps beyond dots in the opener. Now if I'm running with an FC co-healer, I can do more. When I ran Zurvan EX on my own in party finder, I only found one or two WHM who were good enough and geared enough to give me room to dps most of the fight, but when I ran it with my static I could do full dps on the opener then my static main healer and I split the dps and healing very evenly for the rest of the fight.

We should foster a supportive community, not a hostile one. Encourage dps but don't get mean about it if someone declines. Barring a few examples of people filling their time by dancing or jumping around in circles, most people are just doing their best.

I think we're all on the same page about this, we're just using different words and perspectives to frame our arguments.

[Lambdafish]

After a ton of back and forth I think, at last, I get where Feyona is coming from. A lot of people keep coming back in to stir the pot, though.

That is true, and I have seen her point, but there are still issues with her argument, such as the dismissal of the desires of her raid team, and the fact that she can't accept that being kicked was justified and nobody is at fault. She is very focused on the fact that cleric should be banned or changed because "elitist players kick people who aren't good enough" when in actual fact she was with a group that was looking for a healer beyond her skill level. It is a sad situation, that I wish could be discussed with less hostility and more listening

[Deliciou5]

That is true, and I have seen her point, but there are still issues with her argument, such as the dismissal of the desires of her raid team, and the fact that she can't accept that being kicked was justified and nobody is at fault. She is very focused on the fact that cleric should be banned or changed because "elitist players kick people who aren't good enough" when in actual fact she was with a group that was looking for a healer beyond her skill level. It is a sad situation, that I wish could be discussed with less hostility and more listening

I agree, if only she could take full advantage of your advice then there probably wouldn't be any hostility in this thread at all.Alas she cannot really address people properly and doesn't make a lot of sense, she also doesn't seem to read what you say to her a lot of the time, asking questions or trying to make points that has already been addressed a million times.I have been absent from the thread for a while, and after you read a bunch of pages of people being so nice and articulate and illustrating their points so well to her and going out of their way to explain things in the best possible terms over and over, it's bit hard to not to be a bit irritated on how she repeatedly acts like a stonewall and seems like she has not read most of what you said despite the effort and work put into some of these wonderful posts. Maybe you are all right, maybe the pot shouldn't have been stirred, it's a waste of time.

[Feyona]

I agree, if only she could take full advantage of your advice then there probably wouldn't be any hostility in this thread at all.Alas she cannot really address people properly and doesn't make a lot of sense, she also doesn't seem to read what you say to her a lot of the time, asking questions or trying to make points that has already been addressed a million times.

what actually doesnt make sense is saying or implying that I cant be in a savage team and be casual, when I am. There has been agreement from me too when Ive said its optimal but you dont see that it seems. I keep saying I do what my team wants and thats not heard either . When I say I dps when I can that falls on deaf ears too. The hostility sometimes comes from some of your assumptions about me as well even though Ive been as open and honest as I can be bar human flaws like not rembering

[Judge_Xero]

That is true, and I have seen her point, but there are still issues with her argument, such as the dismissal of the desires of her raid team, and the fact that she can't accept that being kicked was justified and nobody is at fault.

Great summary, it really sums up how I was feeling about the situation and why I went through such lengths to put light on that scenario (although you explain it much better than I could have).

I didn't want any future or current healers that could be reading this thread to feel like there was a ton of pressure to instantly be a Pro at doing healer DPS or get kicked, because that will simply cause an issue to push against the meta and limits the ability to adapt and become a better healer. (some will either quit the healer roll, or be too scared to attempt it for fear of failing initially)

[Feyona]

Great summary, it really sums up how I was feeling about the situation and why I went through such lengths to put light on that scenario (although you explain it much better than I could have).

I didn't want any future or current healers that could be reading this thread to feel like there was a ton of pressure to instantly be a Pro at doing healer DPS or get kicked, because that will simply cause an issue to push against the meta and limits the ability to adapt and become a better healer. (some will either quit the healer roll, or be too scared to attempt it for fear of failing initially)

So true but then bourne was saying how expected it was and most teams require it. That was why I saw a probem with that expectation.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

So true but then bourne was saying how expected it was and most teams require it. That was why I saw a probem with that expectation.

Key phrasing you glossed over in Xero's post: "a ton of pressure to instantly be a Pro."

At no point have I ever insinuated any disagree with that sentiment. I spoke about healers who flatout refuse to DPS or improve their performance. Seeing a healer pull sub 200 DPS despite weeks of practice can get irksome, especially if everyone else is looking for ways to improve.