As a healer, is it my job to DPS? A new perspective.

[Feyona]

It's starting to sound like I'm the only one who's actually quite happy with Cleric Stance.

Your right, at the beginning of pandaria it was almost unplayable cos theyed nerfed it so much. but by the time you got to raiding it really was op after the adjustment. I did get a sort of buzz out of being the highest healer through dps. It was a very fun class to play though and was 'different' it a shame people didnt like it being op etc and complained so much it was nerfed for 'bala'nce. It actually wasnt op as a healer unless you played it right and you couldnt just spam smite in raids . 2 discs in a group had a job to keep healing up. But here the healing requirements are lower and dps requirements higher. Ideal for the job here. I dont like walking tight ropes tbh . In fact hate it needs a balance there. On wow healing really was a full time job. I had all six healers and my least favourite was holy priest, which is almost the same as wmg here boring to play and just direct heals. I like sch here cos its a different kind of healer. I dont like all the dots on it cos its tedious and repetitive. I hate cleric cos it causes wipes and Ive seen it happen and its makes me panic . It is in my view an unnecessary handicap.

[Feyona]

i will dps only if the dam player dose not demand that i have to dps my job is <healer>

I feel the same about wanting a different role to play but the feedback I get here is that you dont have the luxury of a role like that cos theres dps in your tool kit. We all should look at why people like healing and why we enjoy having a role. Which may be more important to some than others think. From what I see here though the confusion will continue it seems

[Transient_Shadow]

It all depends. If the party is doing a great job and avoiding damage then it never hurts to sprinkle in some dps. However if your tank is being a stuffed turkey and not using his cooldowns (we all know the type) then you'll probably be too busy keeping him alive.

Don't worry about dps jerks who demand you do two jobs at once. your primary role is that of a healer. DPS for the party is a reward for their effort in not getting hurt. if they're getting their asses handed to them then it just can't be helped

[Feyona]

They did listen. Creator is significantly easier than Midas or Gordias. If either of those raid difficulties were applicable to this discussion, healer DPS wouldn't be debated it would be downright required by everyone. With Gordias, if you spotted than 400-500 DPS on Scholar, you were kicked.

Like how we cannot force you to DPS, you cannot force the community to radically change based around your preferences.

No you cant force like that cos no one is forced to play the game, but one could say overt and covert pressure to do it is the same thing as being forced after all, like you say no group will have a non dpsing sch. The majority of statics inly want sch for that reason and the rest of the community expect it. No one is harrassing you though to do something you dont enjoy. Bit of a difference in the two comparisons

[Judge_Xero]

Removing the need for it at the same time as adding utility and value to the healer DPS abilities would be in line with removing the DPS reduction on foes for bards. It won't please everyone (And I STILL see bards that refuse to sing it) but it would help move things forward for sure.

Hmmmm? I may be confused on your wording but Foes doesn't give BRD a DPS reduction like Ballad/Paeon. I do see your other points though that nothing other than the player base really enforces the Healer DPS Meta outside of solo content.

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Creating a mini-game within the healing tools for healers to manage outside of DPS while increasing required healing seems like a fun idea. I still just worry about healers that can barely heal Creator Savage while others are able to DPS the majority of the time while keeping everyone up.

At least what we see currently with the healer DPS meta is that the healing requirements are pretty low so:
- healers that struggle just to heal can keep up
- healers that are more skilled can keep everyone alive while fitting in DPS where they can
- Top tier healers can just DPS 90% of the time

How would that get addressed so that we don't have players coming back here asking for the healing requirements get nerfed because they keep getting kicked from statics for not being able to keep everyone alive?

[Feyona]

Hmmmm? I may be confused on your wording but Foes doesn't give BRD a DPS reduction like Ballad/Paeon. I do see your other points though that nothing other than the player base really enforces the Healer DPS Meta outside of solo content.

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At least what we see currently with the healer DPS meta is that the healing requirements are pretty low so:
- healers that struggle just to heal can keep up
- healers that are more skilled can keep everyone alive while fitting in DPS where they can
- Top tier healers can just DPS 90% of the time

How would that get addressed so that we don't have players coming back here asking for the healing requirements get nerfed because they keep getting kicked from statics for not being able to keep everyone alive?

3 levels of difficulty, instead of a huge leap from hard to extreme and normal to savage if I was doing the first two id still like a mount tho, because id still be putting 100% effort into it. Saying that tho normal is a joke how easy it is now I can dps alot of it, but it wasnt at first. Also some of this ability to dps comes from being in a good group like tanks using cds and dps staying alive. Its not really so clear cut as just the healer's skill level.

[Judge_Xero]

3 levels of difficulty, instead of a huge leap from hard to extreme and normal to savage if I was doing the first two id still like a mount tho, because id still be putting 100% effort into it. Saying that tho normal is a joke how easy it is now I can dps alot of it, but it wasnt at first. Also some of this ability to dps comes from being in a good group like tanks using cds and dps staying alive. Its not really so clear cut as just the healer's skill level.

I was wanting to look at how things would work if the healing requirements were much higher where the potential for DPS is 0 and all healers can focus on is keeping people alive and how difficult that would be to balance.

So minimum ilvl Creator Savage: i255
A12S = 50% DPS uptime MH and 90% DPS uptime OH 70% combined DPS uptime with 80% Combined Healing uptime (HOTS, PET Etc) @ 4200 HPS

This group has the potential to increase their HPS by an additional 2.1k HPS @ i255 for a total 6300 HPS

VS Max ilvl i270
A12S = 0% DPS uptime MH and 40% DPS uptime OH 20% combined DPS uptime with 95% combined healing uptime @ 4400 HPS (3200 HPS if converted to i255)

This group has the potential to increase their HPS by 800 HPS @ i270 for a total of 5200 HPS (3800 HPS if converted to i255)

If the raids were tuned to the healing requirement of the max healing potential of skilled players then team 2 would need 20% Echo @ i270 to reach the healing potential of team 1 @ i255 without Echo.

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Sure 3 levels of difficulty would be nice, but IMO wasted resources because most wouldn't touch the highest tier of difficulty and those who did would complain that it's impossible to heal.

But the main thing I'm asking is how would you lessen the skill gap between average and skilled players where you allow average players to beat content and reduce DPS windows for skilled players.

[Feyona]

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Sure 3 levels of difficulty would be nice, but IMO wasted resources because most wouldn't touch the highest tier of difficulty and those who did would complain that it's impossible to heal.

But the main thing I'm asking is how would you lessen the skill gap between average and skilled players where you allow average players to beat content and reduce DPS windows for skilled players.

Does t have to be attuned to the very max healing potential, or are you allowed to take a breather for two second? After all humans arnt always so precise about movement. You still got your absorbs as well im guessing you didnt count them in your calculation. Smart though, Im not a numbers person myself. As for three difficulties Id think it would be set at a difficulty level that people according to statistics could do

[SeriousxSarcasm]

It all depends. If the party is doing a great job and avoiding damage then it never hurts to sprinkle in some dps. However if your tank is being a stuffed turkey and not using his cooldowns (we all know the type) then you'll probably be too busy keeping him alive.

Don't worry about dps jerks who demand you do two jobs at once. your primary role is that of a healer. DPS for the party is a reward for their effort in not getting hurt. if they're getting their asses handed to them then it just can't be helped

I think this is a fair way to look at it.

[Lambdafish]

It all depends. If the party is doing a great job and avoiding damage then it never hurts to sprinkle in some dps. However if your tank is being a stuffed turkey and not using his cooldowns (we all know the type) then you'll probably be too busy keeping him alive.

Don't worry about dps jerks who demand you do two jobs at once. your primary role is that of a healer. DPS for the party is a reward for their effort in not getting hurt. if they're getting their asses handed to them then it just can't be helped

This is actually the pro-DPS argument of the thread. We like players to at least try to maintain a wholesome view of their toolkit, and we are condeming lazy players who choose not to. I brought up (and was ignored because of more pointless moaning about the community) what the devs could do in content to keep healers more occupied so that their default isn't DPS, and that is a perfectly valid discussion.

Healer DPS isn't vital as a basis (though if you are trying to skip a phase, it is), but it is 150% better than overhealing/doing nothing.