The Feast

[Februs]

When I saw that gold/plat/diamond would get matches together this season I was happy to actually see competitive matches, but out of the 100+ games I've played I've maybe seen 1 game where I had 2~3 gold+ on my team and the other. The algorithm that they're using must be broken or not actually what is advertised.

This could also have a lot to do with the fact that there are currently no diamond ranked players, a couple platinum players per data centre, and a mere handful of golds, at the moment. On Primal there's somewhere around 20 or 30 gold ranked players. On Aether there's maybe 30 or 40. That seems like a lot, but when you compare that to the VAST majority of players who are still unranked-silver rank, then it's not hard to see why gold players are being teamed up with lower ranks than themselves. Consider the fact that not all of those gold players are on at the same time, and it's even easier to understand. I'm really not sure what people are expecting to see here, especially this early in the season. The fact is that there's really not enough players, especially at gold or higher, for the algorithm to be working any differently than it is right now.

[Kaiyoko]

This could also have a lot to do with the fact that there are currently no diamond ranked players, a couple platinum players per data centre, and a mere handful of golds, at the moment.

That still doesn't change the fact that high ranking players are being matched with bronze and unranked. I would rather wait 30min+ or not queue at all for a competitive match w/ silvers, golds, or plats. Before I stopped queuing I would get matches w/ 3 unranked, bronze, or players there for lore/eso most of the time that make the team lose in less then 2mins because they don't understand what's going on resulting in a ranking loss for players that are treating this competitively.

It's extremely frustrating to be high ranked being matched with players who don't even try or don't really care about PvP. I've received plenty of comments from players similar to "xD why do you care, it's just PvP". I understand other players would like to do it casually, but this is a ranked mode with competitive achievements and rewards on the line. Like I said above, I'd rather it just not match me at all then get players in unranked / bronze because of that attitude. Others have stated this but there really needs to be an unranked PvP 4v4 queue for the Feast as well to hopefully filter out some players.

Edit: In relation to the unranked / bronze not understanding what's going on. I feel like SE wants high ranking players to the inexperienced how to PvP with how it's currently set up. Problem is you're given 1 min before the gates open to explain the plan to everyone. Most of the time w/ more experience players much doesn't need to be said. Inexperienced players need more coaching and guidance which is complicated to fit into that 1min. 1/2 the time players aren't even loading until 20~30 seconds. You also can't teach someone their class and it's extremely obvious when a healer isn't up to par.

[Praesul]

Edit: In relation to the unranked / bronze not understanding what's going on. I feel like SE wants high ranking players to the inexperienced how to PvP with how it's currently set up. Problem is you're given 1 min before the gates open to explain the plan to everyone. Most of the time w/ more experience players much doesn't need to be said. Inexperienced players need more coaching and guidance which is complicated to fit into that 1min. 1/2 the time players aren't even loading until 20~30 seconds. You also can't teach someone their class and it's extremely obvious when a healer isn't up to par.

People in gold have hundreds of matches of experience, probably more from previous season and from playing in Frontline, and it's like SE expects people to cram all that experience into new players within a minute.

It's insanity.

[Februs]

I've received plenty of comments from players similar to "xD why do you care, it's just PvP".

I was always under the impression that Aether had the 'better' PvP community, but some of the stories I've heard from your data centre make me very happy to be on Primal ... >.>

Regardless, I understand your frustrations, but that's no reason to shoot queues in the foot. You might be happy to have a 30+ minute wait time in order to avoid the bronze and unranked tier, but SE has to consider the community as a whole. They can't base matchmaking solely on the whims and wants of the elitists, especially when the actual point of the game is to just play the game. If matchmaking is too restrictive, then you end up with stagnant queues. Stagnant queues create an exclusive and stagnant ranking system. We already saw how that worked in season 1, and it was awfully boring until the failure of Shatter brought people back to Feast. Even then, untested players were still a problem. It's just that the buck of dealing with them was passed down to silver ranked players instead of gold.

Don't get me wrong here, I do agree, wholeheartedly, that there is a certain level of play that should be upheld in a ranked game mode. I just don't think that overly restrictive matchmaking is the answer. An un-ranked game mode sounds good on paper ... but, quite frankly I don't think anyone would queue for it, so it would be a pointless gesture on SE's part. I'm inclined to think that some kind of qualification system should be in place. I just don't know how it should be implemented, especially when SE took pre-seasons off of the table ...

[Enlial]

I think, everything considered, the change I'd most like to see is something along the lines of "upon a loss, lose rank based on the lowest ranked member of your party. On a win, gain rank based on the rank of the highest ranked member of your opponents party." It certainly isnt perfect, but I dont think there is a perfect solution. If we had things working that way I think it'd blunt a lot of the rage towards newer players ("gdi what a horrible loss, oh but thank god we had this unranked player on our team so we only lost 10 points". Would make ppl much less apt to rage against said unranked player). Yeah it might make things more grindy since we'd probably see a higher net gain of points over more matches played, but thats pretty much been established as a necessary evil. Exploitativeness wouldnt really be any worse or better than it is currently, as far as I can see, but if eventually enough people start queuing, well, less predictability would cut down on a lot of it.

[Nakanishi]

snip

There'd be more diamond/platinum players if Gold+ weren't getting paired with unranked players. As it is now, Gold is just a giant wall of dwindling win rates.

[Praesul]

It's pretty sad when I see even the best players on the leaderboard struggle to climb, and quite a few of them LOSING points some days, especially with how good their winrates are. Top 30 or so on Aether is a clown fiesta because matches are being decided solely on who gets more bronze/unranked players in their party, and it's showing. Everyone's progress this season is really slow, and a lot of top players aren't even queuing anymore, or only queuing at certain times just to avoid the insane RNG swings.

[Kaiyoko]

It's pretty sad when I see even the best players on the leaderboard struggle to climb, and quite a few of them LOSING points some days, especially with how good their winrates are. Top 30 or so on Aether is a clown fiesta because matches are being decided solely on who gets more bronze/unranked players in their party, and it's showing. Everyone's progress this season is really slow, and a lot of top players aren't even queuing anymore, or only queuing at certain times just to avoid the insane RNG swings.

Yeah this is definitely how I feel. I was in top 10 on Aether for a week and then I started getting non-stop bronze/unranked, lost a ton of points due to 2-3 dc's and 2-3min matches with bronze / unranked and just don't feel like dealing with it anymore.

Regardless, I understand your frustrations, but that's no reason to shoot queues in the foot. You might be happy to have a 30+ minute wait time in order to avoid the bronze and unranked tier, but SE has to consider the community as a whole. They can't base matchmaking solely on the whims and wants of the elitists, especially when the actual point of the game is to just play the game. If matchmaking is too restrictive, then you end up with stagnant queues. Stagnant queues create an exclusive and stagnant ranking system. We already saw how that worked in season 1, and it was awfully boring until the failure of Shatter brought people back to Feast. Even then, untested players were still a problem. It's just that the buck of dealing with them was passed down to silver ranked players instead of gold.

The thing is they have more people available for bronze / unranked to give people experience playing with players that are closer to their skill level that is more regularly available. I've been matched with all variations of roles, so I know the people are available in queue. They're matching the golds+ w/ those people just because of our spot in queue and what seems to be how their match making takes 1~2 golds per team 2~3 bronze / unranked. They would only be dramatically slowing the queues for Gold+ if it actually followed what they said in the patch notes.

[Praesul]

Yeah this is definitely how I feel. I was in top 10 on Aether for a week and then I started getting non-stop bronze/unranked, lost a ton of points due to 2-3 dc's and 2-3min matches with bronze / unranked and just don't feel like dealing with it anymore.

I fell out of gold THREE TIMES because soon after I get to gold, I get strings of games with super inexperienced players. It's extremely disheartening, but I managed to muscle through and get back every single time. At this point though I don't think I'll keep going, it's just way too volatile.

[Februs]

The thing is they have more people available for bronze / unranked to give people experience playing with players that are closer to their skill level that is more regularly available.

I get you. I'm just a little more concerned about the later end of the season. Back in season 1, golds and higher flat out stopped queuing near the mid to late season just to protect their rank, and the system rewarded them for doing that. They didn't have to worry about losing their spot because there wasn't enough activity to generate any movement in the rankings. The top 100 barely budged an inch for the last month (until the last week, when people started to scramble for last minute points). Personally, I don't think that's a good thing, because I don't believe anyone should feel 'safe' about their rank in a game mode that is supposed to be competitive ... and it's just plain boring when that happens.

I mean, I HATE losing a match because of a crummy team. My losing streak from last night made me want to punch myself in the face and bring down the ban hammer on everyone who contributed to it, but when I remember the utter boredom of not playing PvP at all I get the totally different attitude of being as inclusive as possible. It's a very strange tug-o-war ...