Crafting Grind

[Ethir]

Not entirely true; if you pay attention to the syn process; as long as you acquire 1 quality it's consider a success or at least not fail; the skill Epiphany would increase your success chance if you think it like that; you could use rapid syn in case you're no way to complete - using epiphany in rapid syn -

Quality effect the reward you get in leves; there are 5 tries; try to make quality of those items higher and you will see the evaluation for you work also increase; hence your reward increase also + it increase the exp you earn after finish it. Well you guys may not pay attention to it; but a GSM alway have to increase quality even at those grade 1 or 2 items; cause there are limit for accessory; a +2 or 3 grade 2 would provide you the same amount of def as grade 3 but less slot needed.

Well i agree if that you mean bearable ; yes it would be more fun; but to increase exp reward in leves higher would be unbalance.

Just spamming wont get you anywhere; i wonder why they put in these abilities and difference syn options when no one pay attention how to use them >.< .

[Ethir]

@Kelvana: 1- About the dangerous camp; have you tried others nations ?
2- You made a pt and i dont count that and i dont want a party for exp either - that sound really stupid, i mean your purpose just to level up then what ? farming leves to sell gold ?, you should understand the class you play and enjoy the game -; my char level up by leves cause i like to read those quests they give out and understand the world; enjoy it. It is called mmoRPG; role playing game. But i agree that it's need some improvement. An idea i take form Mabinogi; Production party, but it will not increase the chance of your success but the quality you archive. How about that ?

[Kelvana]

Rapid is risky as even with epiphany, any failures are amplified. I have tried to use rapids, but I find it too unreliable in comparison to standard.

Quality has a negligible effect on the end experience reward, not enough the extra time needed to raise quality significantly. at 28 weaver, I normally get around 1400-1600 bonus for level 30 synths, in addition to 400-600 per synth. Failure rate I would eyeball at around 10-30% of the time. I find that failure rates make synths of above the 600 exp mark unreliable. My problem is that the 1400-1600 bonus is not worth going to a camp like blue fog without the use of anima (say if anima is low). The leves that can be turned in for that same bonus in town however I do find fair at this level.

Just spamming is what I have resorted to now, because the system as it stands right now is intolerable. It has taken me a good 20hrs estimated in order to get to level 28. I did start off trying to pay attention to every single attempt, but after crafting for 2-3hrs straight for the umpteenth time, I find that paying attention only affords me a slight increase in experience return, which I determined was not worth paying attention the whole time when I could be doing something actually enjoyable like watching a movie.

And for the record, even when I spam, I do use things like Preserve in order to complete a potentially failing synth. I may spam, but I only semi pay attention, because the system is so tedious as it stands.

[Kelvana]

@Kelvana: 1- About the dangerous camp; have you tried others nations ?
2- You made a pt and i dont count that and i dont want a party for exp either - that sound really stupid, i mean your purpose just to level up then what ? farming leves to sell gold ?, you should understand the class you play and enjoy the game -; my char level up by leves cause i like to read those quests they give out and understand the world; enjoy it. It is called mmoRPG; role playing game. But i agree that it's need some improvement. An idea i take form Mabinogi; Production party, but it will not increase the chance of your success but the quality you archive. How about that ?

Ul'dah is the only nation with sufficient (albeit lackluster) selection of weaver leves. I joined a party because it was fun.... Party play is why I play an MMO. Partying isn't just faster to level, it's also a lot more fun especially for me.

[Bluetaro]

Just spamming wont get you anywhere; i wonder why they put in these abilities and difference syn options when no one pay attention how to use them >.< .

I understand that using the abilities may help your ability to craft and increase your success rate, but it is a false statement to say that spamming doesn't get you anywhere. In fact, every craft I have leveled at the moment was due to spamming standard while watching Youtube, movies, and studying.

[Ethir]

@Kelvana: To me party for exp is not fun; only strain me out; I only party when doing quest. I dont understand you post on quality; could you explain it clearer ? Anyway; you spent 2-3 hrs really ? lolz i only spent 30 mins or at least 1h if i use the company manual. Like i said you should enjoy the game more, i played 4 class at the same times; so i dont feel bore; half hour i play war and magic; half i play hand. Sigh...... i believe they put a lot of though in this game; but the ways people play is too boring; very few people actually play this game; read the quest; even leves quest; people should put more attention to the RPG of this game. I really hope that SE wont change much in next patch; i hate to see this game become those game line LineAge II or silkroad.

@Bluetaro: what i mean is understand the role you play; every trick, every skill, my main char gladiator also have tricks for skills; combination to increase damage. If you just spamming or fast leveling you wont really playing. It's like you doing it just for the sake of nothing to do. I mean what are you going to do next when you reach 50 in all classes ? when you know nothing about the game; i would only think that you intend to sell gold in game. Do you know what Amalj'aa put on their weapon ? or why the practice of using herbal poultice is banned ? There are more to this game than just archiving level like those others mass products online game.

[Bluetaro]

@Bluetaro: what i mean is understand the role you play; every trick, every skill, my main char gladiator also have tricks for skills; combination to increase damage. If you just spamming or fast leveling you wont really playing. It's like you doing it just for the sake of nothing to do. I mean what are you going to do next when you reach 50 in all classes ? when you know nothing about the game; i would only think that you intend to sell gold in game. Do you know what Amalj'aa put on their weapon ? or why the practice of using herbal poultice is banned ? There are more to this game than just archiving level like those others mass products online game.

I see where you are coming from and I agree with your statement that by rushing the exp grind I have a worse understanding of my class/craft than somebody who is dedicating and devoting their time class by class and craft by craft. The point you are trying to make regarding "there is more to this game than achieving levels" is absolutely true and I won't disagree with that. However, when you asked about the Amalj'aa putting things on their weapons or why herbal poultices are banned, I'm not sure where you are trying to go with that. Are you suggesting that I should immerse myself into the lore and role-playing aspect of this game? That by itself is a fine suggestion and I could see why I would enjoy the game more if I did so, but I hope you're not suggesting role-playing and lore immersion is a requirement to enjoy an online game.

I actually enjoy playing the game because I like to build and develop characters, I enjoy making money and earning skills, abilities, and experience. While the lore of the game is fun and all, and certainly very interesting, I actually don't let myself get too wrapped up into it because I have other interests that I care more about. Why would I be interested in knowing about that Amalj'aa trivial fact or about those herbal poultices? Seems pointless for me to know, but I'm not disrespecting your right to enjoying that type of thing. Kudos to you.

Anyway, with crafting, my main goal is to get them to the 40s as quick as I can and then do research about the abilities at a later time. Why do I want them that high? Well, as I said earlier I like developing my character and part of that includes wanting to have some crafts leveled up so I can attach materia onto my gear and help my LS out with their materia craft. It's also very handy to be able to repair my own weapons and armor.

So as you can see, I'm not trying to be the best crafter out there who knows the ins and outs of every skill. I could really care less about that stuff. What I do care about though, and I believe you should too, is that the crafting system in FFXIV should be more engaging and more entertaining than it currently is. If SE could accomplish this, it would attract more players who like to craft into playing FFXIV, which I see as a good goal for them to strive for.

This fact remains; there are many players who are crafting where all they are doing is spamming a single button to level up because it is currently a very boring and bland system, and I would like to see improvements made to this system for the benefit of all players.

[Kelvana]

@ Ethir: Well this game is not about leveling only. I play in parties to learn my role in addition to being fun. If you don't get used to party play, you will have a hard time with the content that is meant to be enjoyed when you are level 50. Parties may be fast, but they also teach you how to play your class in a group. I do not like powerlevelers though; when I say I joined parties, I mean full 8 man teams where everyone has tasks and needs to work as a team in order to get things done. This is what MMO's are about imo.

I do enjoy this game, please don't misunderstand me. I do plenty of solo activities as well in order to level up, like leves and quests I prefer to do solo or duo, and they are enjoyable. I play a little of everything myself too .

With that said, I realize that this does not translate to crafting, which are strictly a solo activity. The rewards and boons of having a crafting job, as well as leveling it are entirely different and need to be looked at seperately as such.

With crafting I wanted to get weaver and carpenter to 50 as fast as I could initially. Then I started to realize how dull, tedious and time consuming seriously leveling a crafting job really is. I now just intend to finish weaver first, then go back to other crafts. As for company manuals, I know what they do, but the expenditure of seals is far too great to use them without end. I know there are ways to get a lot of seals, but the only repeatable ways for the long term are not a time efficient way to craft. 1hr nets 80-140ish seals or so, resulting in a couple of hours to get enough for a manual for an extra bonus totalling around 14k exp; in 2hrs of just crafting I can get 30k exp at least, so my time is better spent crafting.

My problem is that working a full time job, I have a very finite amount of time that I can play. I love the game, and like to do a little bit of everything, soloing and partying, why limit myself to just one?

[Physic]

Not entirely true; if you pay attention to the syn process; as long as you acquire 1 quality it's consider a success or at least not fail; the skill Epiphany would increase your success chance if you think it like that; you could use rapid syn in case you're no way to complete - using epiphany in rapid syn -

Quality effect the reward you get in leves; there are 5 tries; try to make quality of those items higher and you will see the evaluation for you work also increase; hence your reward increase also + it increase the exp you earn after finish it. Well you guys may not pay attention to it; but a GSM alway have to increase quality even at those grade 1 or 2 items; cause there are limit for accessory; a +2 or 3 grade 2 would provide you the same amount of def as grade 3 but less slot needed.

Well i agree if that you mean bearable ; yes it would be more fun; but to increase exp reward in leves higher would be unbalance.

Just spamming wont get you anywhere; i wonder why they put in these abilities and difference syn options when no one pay attention how to use them >.< .

qualitiy effects the money, and items you get, not the xp reward i tested this myself, unless i didnt get a high enough quality, i had a rating of over 100, to be honest though, the only way you will get over 100 on a leve, is if it is substantially lower than your level. in which case, the actual synth gives you virtually no exp, you are better off accepting a higher difficulty leve.

the cap is now 750+(seemingly random amount from say 3-20) exp for a synth 10 levels higher than you, in general it is fairly difficult and you wont succeed enough of the time to make it worth the effort, though some recipes are easier for whatever reason. it also take longer with fails succeeds and having to use a number of skills.

the current formula is 250 exp for something your level and 50 for each additional level over you, the variance is like 3-20 more than that. quality has no effect anymore, if it once did.

far as material costs, uhh i dont think you are counting the crystal shards, even a cheap shard is 100 gil, so if a recipe uses 3 iron ore and 4 shards, and you payed 300 an ore (really cheap) the cost is 900+400, if the npc aint paying 1300 gil you are taking a loss. Even if you gathered all the materials, the fact is you could have sold them, so you are still taking a loss. Which is not to say you cant profit in crafting, at some levels, with some recipies, if the market it right, but it is definately not the norm, and usually wont last you forever.

and when you get to like 40 man your talking about like 160 crafts, who is going to need 160 of anything? as it is right now, npc is the only answer.

and it has gotten easier and easier, now its literally to the point you can spam one button and get a 500 exp craft 8/10 times, doing that for 1.5 minutes a synth for 150+ synths is incredibly boring, it needs a redesign

[Kelvana]

I agree completely with you Physic. It's easy as it is already, just boring. The real question is what can they do to make it more enjoyable. It'll be tough to pull it off and keep it balanced. I've thought about it a long while now and will admit my ideas aren't without their flaws..

Real reason I started this thread was so that maybe we could get a few people brainstorming and help give Square-Enix a few ideas or feedback to help them take a direction with crafting that would make it more fun to all of us. So with that in mind, I would like to open this query up to anyone reading to criticize my 3 ideas in the original post, as well as to to make some suggestions of your own!

Cheers for the night!