Do you want Dragoon to have a pet!? (poll)

[Enfarious]

let me rephrase. I would rather have dragon breaths/magic then be a very well made pet class. Its not that I care about a wyvern its that I dont want dragoon to be a pet class because I don't enjoy pet classes. Also dont know why people think DRG is so weak, its not but if you are comparing to AoE ability then you do get the impression. I guess i never looked at DRG and said I want to play that class for its AoE capabilities. If you compare BLM and DRG for single target DPS then you have to consider BLM is better because it doesn't have to worry about positioning for combos. If DRG didn't I'm willing to bet its damage would be comparable or better.

So what you've said here is, if your looking for max single target DPS DRG isn't the best, and if your looking for AoE max then DRG is not the best. So then really what I'm thinking is that DRG isn't now but to give it some abilities that'd make it useful for more than it's not "top" DPS in any situation, then we all could benefit.
If they come from a pet, great, if not, I'm still ok w/ it, I just am sick of being asked to play "not" DRG because it's not the best at anything at all. MNK has equal or better DPS and more survivability, WAR can tank AoE trash mobs and still hold it's own DPS on single targets especially while Berserk is up. BLM will forever have the highest DPS, that's fine it should, but the relatively low risk that they spew spells with now makes them OPd as a result of WARs insane hate gen.

Really my whole stance is give me something that makes me desirable, idc if it's a pet or not. I don't get why people are so opposed to pets in general. Did they really do people that bad in the past? I loved my PUP, BST wasn't bad, DRG was decent if you subbed the right things and used it well, SMN well let's be real SMN was beast for alot of stuff. Pets in other games were almost all useful, except for a couple vanity ones, what's the worst that could happen here?

[Krausus]

So what you've said here is, if your looking for max single target DPS DRG isn't the best, and if your looking for AoE max then DRG is not the best. So then really what I'm thinking is that DRG isn't now but to give it some abilities that'd make it useful for more than it's not "top" DPS in any situation, then we all could benefit.
If they come from a pet, great, if not, I'm still ok w/ it, I just am sick of being asked to play "not" DRG because it's not the best at anything at all. MNK has equal or better DPS and more survivability, WAR can tank AoE trash mobs and still hold it's own DPS on single targets especially while Berserk is up. BLM will forever have the highest DPS, that's fine it should, but the relatively low risk that they spew spells with now makes them OPd as a result of WARs insane hate gen.

Really my whole stance is give me something that makes me desirable, idc if it's a pet or not. I don't get why people are so opposed to pets in general. Did they really do people that bad in the past? I loved my PUP, BST wasn't bad, DRG was decent if you subbed the right things and used it well, SMN well let's be real SMN was beast for alot of stuff. Pets in other games were almost all useful, except for a couple vanity ones, what's the worst that could happen here?

Why should DRG be the best? Our self sustainability is second to none not sure why you think MNK has more survivability we have access to all their survivability skills as well as Life Surge. Sure DPS is similar but we dont have to burn through mana to sustain ours. BLM is also reliant on a mana pool as well as low survivability. I agree with the direction Yoshi is taking DRG which is to make them a crit based DD.

As for WAR berserk sucks balls and they are not comparable to DRG in damage and they are nerfing SC which is a major factor in WAR hate generation. If you are asked not to bring DRG then those people are idiots.

[syntaxlies]

Why should DRG be the best? Our self sustainability is second to none not sure why you think MNK has more survivability we have access to all their survivability skills as well as Life Surge. Sure DPS is similar but we dont have to burn through mana to sustain ours. BLM is also reliant on a mana pool as well as low survivability. I agree with the direction Yoshi is taking DRG which is to make them a crit based DD.

As for WAR berserk sucks balls and they are not comparable to DRG in damage and they are nerfing SC which is a major factor in WAR hate generation. If you are asked not to bring DRG then those people are idiots.

i would argue that war has the best self sustainability

[Enfarious]

Why should DRG be the best? Our self sustainability is second to none not sure why you think MNK has more survivability we have access to all their survivability skills as well as Life Surge. Sure DPS is similar but we dont have to burn through mana to sustain ours. BLM is also reliant on a mana pool as well as low survivability. I agree with the direction Yoshi is taking DRG which is to make them a crit based DD.

As for WAR berserk sucks balls and they are not comparable to DRG in damage and they are nerfing SC which is a major factor in WAR hate generation. If you are asked not to bring DRG then those people are idiots.

I didn't say it should be the "best" just pointed out that right now it's not the best for anything. I want equal aka balanced. By what was said it's going to go, for DPS don't get a DRG, for tanking don't get a DRG, for AoE killing "trash" mobs don't get a DRG. If DRG is an optimal job for any of those spots please correct me, otherwise let's be real and say that it needs some looking at.

MNK has better survivability and maintaining the otherwise worthless MP pool on MNK isn't hard at all. Life Surge isn't getting you back enough and Second Wind on a non MNK isn't comparable. DRG gets notta else Dreadspike is straight garbage. WAR w/ Rampage up unless your unlucky as all get out can get back obscene amounts of HP, not just w/ SC other WSs crit just as well.

BLM w/ a semi-decent tank has to worry very little about that whole getting hit thing. Running out of MP does happen but it's not enough to actually push any decent BLM DPS below others.

Your right Berserk isn't the best thing going, but in a DD role WAR does hold it's own, after SC and what have you get nerfed we'll see, but then they're buffing Berserk so...

People ask for "not" DRG often, lnc is fine alot of the time, but lnc doesn't have the damage output a DRG does so there's that trade off.



I think though that you skipped past my actual point, which was just asking for balance, through the addition of a pet w/ some nifty buff/enfeeble/heals or some other means.

[Krausus]

i would argue that war has the best self sustainability

yeah you are right, though I guess DRG would be second best

[Krausus]

I didn't say it should be the "best" just pointed out that right now it's not the best for anything. I want equal aka balanced. By what was said it's going to go, for DPS don't get a DRG, for tanking don't get a DRG, for AoE killing "trash" mobs don't get a DRG. If DRG is an optimal job for any of those spots please correct me, otherwise let's be real and say that it needs some looking at.

MNK has better survivability and maintaining the otherwise worthless MP pool on MNK isn't hard at all. Life Surge isn't getting you back enough and Second Wind on a non MNK isn't comparable. DRG gets notta else Dreadspike is straight garbage. WAR w/ Rampage up unless your unlucky as all get out can get back obscene amounts of HP, not just w/ SC other WSs crit just as well.

BLM w/ a semi-decent tank has to worry very little about that whole getting hit thing. Running out of MP does happen but it's not enough to actually push any decent BLM DPS below others.

Your right Berserk isn't the best thing going, but in a DD role WAR does hold it's own, after SC and what have you get nerfed we'll see, but then they're buffing Berserk so...

People ask for "not" DRG often, lnc is fine alot of the time, but lnc doesn't have the damage output a DRG does so there's that trade off.



I think though that you skipped past my actual point, which was just asking for balance, through the addition of a pet w/ some nifty buff/enfeeble/heals or some other means.

what I'm saying is DRG is not garbage like many would like some to believe, sure they can use a boost which they are getting. I just prefer it in the vision of Yoshi. And I still think DRG has better survivability than MNK Life Surge gives plenty of health back and its constant, we also have second wind as well. if you are looking at straight numbers then yes we dont fall at the top or equal in damage as BLM and MNK but you have to take more into consideration than just numbers. IMO BLM has it to easy with combos which is why they can put out so much damage.

[Enfarious]

what I'm saying is DRG is not garbage like many would like some to believe, sure they can use a boost which they are getting. I just prefer it in the vision of Yoshi. And I still think DRG has better survivability than MNK Life Surge gives plenty of health back and its constant, we also have second wind as well. if you are looking at straight numbers then yes we dont fall at the top or equal in damage as BLM and MNK but you have to take more into consideration than just numbers. IMO BLM has it to easy with combos which is why they can put out so much damage.

again you say that MNK and BLM out do DRG by the numbers, what else matters? If we parse lower we parse lower, there's no real argument against the numbers. If the argument is ease of play BLM has it again, and MNK is no harder than DRG.

Life surge at the cost of power surge and second wind on mnk is 900~1k on DRG it's ~350, life surge @3 doesn't compare to that 600 difference in 45 seconds.

I love DRG btw, it was my first 50, was the first in Beta, and at release was first for me, when they altered the abils they gimped it horribly. I want to be able to skewer shit again. I want alot of those old skills back, and would happily throw some of what we have back in the barrel to be recycled. Right now though, I just can't make myself play my DRG, and it makes me sad.

[Alaltus]

again you say that MNK and BLM out do DRG by the numbers, what else matters? If we parse lower we parse lower, there's no real argument against the numbers. If the argument is ease of play BLM has it again, and MNK is no harder than DRG.

Life surge at the cost of power surge and second wind on mnk is 900~1k on DRG it's ~350, life surge @3 doesn't compare to that 600 difference in 45 seconds.

I love DRG btw, it was my first 50, was the first in Beta, and at release was first for me, when they altered the abils they gimped it horribly. I want to be able to skewer shit again. I want alot of those old skills back, and would happily throw some of what we have back in the barrel to be recycled. Right now though, I just can't make myself play my DRG, and it makes me sad.

What should be dragoon's saving grace when it comes to being lower dps is that it's emnity shedding abilities should allow it to go all out where other dd's hold back. But throughout my experience of endgame i dont recall dd's having to hold back beyound allowing the tank to build up initial hate other than in certain instances where holding back isnt emnity related or emnity resetting and so has no relation to their previous emnity levels. Whats more many bosses where shedding hate might possibly help dragoon prove to only save it from a fraction of the dmg the boss dishes out as the major threat from said bosses are from aoe's indiscriminate of your enmity.

I've given out my view on surges before, they require too much micro management and really arent worth it when it comes down to it. If your a really good dragoon who can keep power surge up constantly and avoid all aoes sent your way then more power to you. I myself however just cant justify the extra damage i would/could take by keeping power surge up as well as the tp cost and the nuisance of it. Life surge is just garbage on anything worth fighting sure it helps when farming mobs that can actually hurt you but thats about it. I've been playing lancer since alpha and these surges are at the worst they have ever been.

[Enfarious]

What should be dragoon's saving grace when it comes to being lower dps is that it's emnity shedding abilities should allow it to go all out where other dd's hold back. But throughout my experience of endgame i dont recall dd's having to hold back beyound allowing the tank to build up initial hate other than in certain instances where holding back isnt emnity related or emnity resetting and so has no relation to their previous emnity levels. Whats more many bosses where shedding hate might possibly help dragoon prove to only save it from a fraction of the dmg the boss dishes out as the major threat from said bosses are from aoe's indiscriminate of your enmity.

I've given out my view on surges before, they require too much micro management and really arent worth it when it comes down to it. If your a really good dragoon who can keep power surge up constantly and avoid all aoes sent your way then more power to you. I myself however just cant justify the extra damage i would/could take by keeping power surge up as well as the tp cost and the nuisance of it. Life surge is just garbage on anything worth fighting sure it helps when farming mobs that can actually hurt you but thats about it. I've been playing lancer since alpha and these surges are at the worst they have ever been.

I agree with everything you just said, they've all but destroyed LNC/DRG for us. I don't waste TP on surges, the boost to dmg from power surge isn't worth the TP lost, when needed life surge isn't potent enough to warrant maintaining it.
The mid range nature of lnc/drg, I believe, was meant to keep us out of AoE range for alot of that stuff, but somehow that didn't pan out. We got elusive jump, yay, I think that's helped me ~4 times now, that may change w/ the WAR balancing act, then enmity reduction may be useful again.
There isn't really anything else going for it tho, MNK might have to hold back a bit where DRG doesn't but chances are the extra enmity reduction isn't going to make up the DPS anyway and BLM has plenty of enmity reduction for it to go balls to the walls.
If they gave us back just a little of our old pimpness, the surges, the power, maybe enough distance to be clear of general mob centered AoE so we don't have to run off or get hit. Something, anything back.

[AreeSoothsayer]

Read through all 14 pages, got an idea while doing it too.

Why not make twin paths for the souls? Since this is about the wyvern pet, which I want, I will use the Dragoon to show my idea.

There would be the path of the Destroyer, hunting down and slaying dragons, using a ritual to steal their strength for his own. This would gain the dragoon special abilities, both active and passive, to enhance his own stregnth.

The path of the protector would be one allied with the dragons, gaining one as a companiion at his side.

You could even have the turning point be running across a battle where a dragon protects her nest from hunters intent on slaying her and crushing the eggs. Aid the hunters, fight the dragon, destroy the eggs and be initiated into the dark art of stealing a dragons power for themselves.

Or you could choose to aid the dragon, fighting by her side (which would be awesome by itself for me) against the hunters. Probably a more difficult fight since they outnumber you. Once you survived and protected both the dragoness and the eggs you would be honored by witnessing their hatching where one would bond with you.

Both paths would be followed to increase the dragoon's might. The destroyer hunting down dragons to tear their power from them. The protector finding, guarding or challenging them. But where the destroyer would be stealing power for himself the protector would be gaining experiance, wisdom and development for the dragonette.

The dragonette would be too young to throw right into battle but during Weapon skills and dragoon jumps it would add it's own hits for a second, undoubtedly smaller, amount of damage on top of his own. It would only come into it's own when it earned enough development to grow into a young dragon. Large enough to fight, large enough to mount and ride but not quite old enough for sustained flight.

Twin paths could be used for all the souls. Bard could be Vocalist and instramentalist. White mage could focus on healing or protection. Black mage ritual or dual cast. (Ritual: Extended castime for additonal effects and damage, Dual Cast: Casting a single spell in both hands, less damage each but overall more.) Paladin, Fortress of Steel or Icon of Virtue. (Defencive skills Vs Increased white magic) and so on and so forth.



Did I come up with all of this just to increase the chances of seeing my beloved Sasavi resurrected in 14? Yus!