Twelveswood

[Vexander]

I can't say I meant to judge it as evil, since Gridania is a flourishing society. I'm just pointing out that the Elements in this case have done an excellent job conditioning the Gridanians in a way similar to a Cult. If the Elements had ulterior motives I believe we would have seen them by now.

[Enkidoh]

They're not 'conditioning' them, inso as much as the only reason the Gelmorrans were even allowed to settle in the forest in the first place was to accept the elementals will (for hundreds of years no one could even communicate with them - it was only through the moogles acting as intermediares that a compact was forged between the spoken races and the elementals, and that mortals were finally allowed to settle on the surface in the Black Shroud... but under strict conditions.).

Considering the Sixth Umbral Era was caused by the spoken races misusing magic to such an extent they were using the power of the Void to destructive ends, and causing such massive aetheric imbalances in the planet the elementals decided that the only way out was to wipe out everything with a global flood, you can't exactly blame them for being somewhat overbearing towards mortals.

[Vexander]

I can actually. If the magics of that era were so dangerous, why would the Elements ever allow mortals to have access to it again? They grant power over White Magic to the Padjals, the aforementioned, 'Privileged Caste,' they created to rule over Gridania. It's entirely cult-like behavior and brainwashing. It's only viewed as acceptable because the Elements are seen as something greater than mortals, rather than just a different kind of lifeform.

[PArcher]

I can actually. If the magics of that era were so dangerous, why would the Elements ever allow mortals to have access to it again?

Because they know they cannot stop it, only delay it. Mortals will gain access to White and Black magic eventually, with or without the Elementals (Ascians say hi). Why not control how [some] of it is given, teach people to fear and respect it?

Look at Amdapor. The Elementals tried to hide it from mortals forever...and yet the ruins are laid bare again, and the trapped Voidsent threaten the forest. If we weren't contracted to clear the ruins out for the Hearers, and treasure hunters got there first...well, I'm fairly certain we'd have a major Voidsent issue in the Shroud right now.

[Vexander]

So it goes back to that point that the Elementals have conditioned the Gridanians to carry out their will, and do as they like. "This magic is bad. You have to hunt down anyone who uses it. Except the people we're giving it to. Because we gave it to them. Because we say its alright for them."

[Alberel]

So it goes back to that point that the Elementals have conditioned the Gridanians to carry out their will, and do as they like. "This magic is bad. You have to hunt down anyone who uses it. Except the people we're giving it to. Because we gave it to them. Because we say its alright for them."

It's not really conditioning though. It's no different to a government deciding who can be trusted with power over things. The Elementals may be a far more abstract and unknowable form of government but they are effectively a form of government of the Shroud. The people living there do so on the condition that they submit to the Elementals' authority as well.

The Elementals recognise that the magics used in the War of the Magi are not inherently evil. They caused the flood because they were being overused for mutually destructive purposes. They are willing to cautiously permit the use of said magics as long as they are heavily restricted and controlled to ensure a repeat of the War of the Magi does not happen. There have been numerous times now that we, using White and Black Magic, have helped the Elementals where they could not have helped themselves.

[Namill]

As adventurers we're not actually 'setting up shop and staying there', we're pretty much transient and are not actually settling in the forest

Neither were Meffrid and his men. Yet Gridanians refused to help his wounded friend because the the previously mentioned rule (which also applies to "receiving the wood's bounty").

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VwLOokwcLx8

[LineageRazor]

I think that it's problematic in general to associate values as we understand them with the Elementals anyway. It's difficult to even imagine what the world might be like to them; it's been stated that they don't sense the world in the same way that we do. Accusations of the elementals trying to foster a cult-like mentality might be similar to accusing a gardener trimming a shrub as trying to indoctrinate the plant. Even if a cult is the result, the elementals likely neither know or care what a cult is. They simply want to maintain their world as they believe it should be maintained. Humans can be tolerated as long as they don't rock the boat - because the last time humans rocked the boat, it was a horrendous disaster for elementals and humans alike.

We don't actually know why the Elementals refuse to let the Ala Mhigans receive aid. They might sense some chaotic factor in them that the Elementals find to be unappealing or even dangerous to the Shroud - and given that Ala Mhigo, not so many years ago, was a belligerent, expansionist empire, it's not beyond imagining to think that a few of the refugees might still harbor notions of stirring up trouble. While it seems cruel from our perspective, perhaps the Elementals were able to sense something that we don't see. Perhaps the suffering refugees aren't as innocent as they seem. The actions of the Elementals have been described as seeming inscrutable and random at times, but that doesn't mean that those actions actually ARE meaningless and random.

[Morningstar1337]

and given that Ala Mhigo, not so many years ago, was a belligerent, expansionist empire

I feel like pointing out that the first target of Ala Mhigo's ambitions is in fact Gridania. Mayhap the Autumn War make the elementals think that Ala Mhigo is no longer trustworthy and likely see their subujation by Garlemald as an overall boon to them at large?

[Koti]

The Elements are something else in the Black Shroud. I had to do some hard thinking back to the days of 1.0 and some of the Gridania quest lines, but I remember some things that dealt with the elements, including when they got upset with a boy and petrified him. Then another time when they were upset by what the Garleans were doing and unleashed their anger on everyone. This pretty much vaporizing people running away left and right, because they don't determine "friend" or "foe" just "people".

Thankfully after the time of Calamity and probably cause of the fact the aetheric flow was really messed up, the Elements don't seem to be as active or as dangerous(???) as they once were. At least I haven't seen any cutsceme in ARR that would make them super dangerous as they were in 1.0, I could be wrong though! But yeah, I think why NPCs act as they do, is because of that old power the elements once possessed and they rather not take those chances.