Players Who Don't pull their weight.

[Alistaire]

Math tells me 100% is maximum how can you give always 110%?

Clearly that's what a limit break means.

Honestly though, the more people put their foot down the better. Vote kick people who aren't contributing and refuse to listen. I'd personally rather wait a bit for someone who tries than enable people to get carried. And the more it becomes the culture to not carry belligerent non-contributors, the more people will think about it before entering df with that mindset.

Also gotta push SE to lower the 4-hour limit on vote kicks. It's a ridiculous limit now considering it was implemented when there were only 2 or 3 roulettes. Now we have double that, and then things that more frequently require kicks like the 24-man raids. Lowering the wait time between vote kicks to 2 hours shouldn't be a problem. Considering you can be reported for kicking without reason there shouldn't even be a limit, but I understand there being some amount. Just 4 hours is far beyond what it should be.

[Sipherous]

@Xlantaa

I would argue that its that mindset that causes people to accept they are doing okay. If you let someone carry on with their train of thought the idea of improving never crosses their mind. The idea that we must cater to the weakest link is unacceptable in my opinion cause although this is a game that line of thought does not equate to progress/improvement or expansion. I accept mediocrity, anyone can do their buffs rotations and such with a degree of effectiveness even if they are slow, but failing to use the tools given to you is about inability to play its pure laziness plain and simple.

1-2-3-4 is unacceptable, nobody should have to suffer with a player not wanting to learn their skills simply cause they don't have the capacity to. If this was a single player game those very same people wouldn't be playing it right now cause they cant and in turn we have to pick up their slack (ie wasted time) because they cant preform. I'm sounding mean yes but that's the reality of it and it works very much the same as the real world, if you cant preform you don't get involved.

[Alistaire]

The funny thing is in dungeons it's not so much a learning rotation thing, it's a refusal to aoe that's the biggest problem.

Melee have some pretty simple and boring aoe "rotations" but they're by far the best option when dealing with 4+ mobs.

But people have this idea that "melee aoe is bad" so they think they shouldn't.

Well yeah melee aoe is not as good as casters but melee aoe is better than melee single target in even medium sized pulls. You'd aoe at 3 mobs on either melee job if you had enough tp, or even if you just have enough space between pulls to recoup. There's literally no benefit to sitting at over 700 tp at the end of a pull no matter what dungeon you're in.

[Rytank]

While I agree that extreme laziness can be a problem at times, n yes it sucks. I would also just like to mention, that people need to not be so hasty to vote kick. Sometimes people get distracted, or are having an off day. About 3 weeks back I got vote kicked from Vark, only thing said to me was GTFO, n bloop I was gone. My healer fc mate that was with me said they kicked me for doing nothing, when I was actually doing my job as pld, their was just a late spawn of a morborl n I immidiately got the blame, i proceeded to go back for a second attempt n i MT'd everything for 75% of the instance. All i'm trying to say is give people a chance at least, n if their performing at least par for the instance, let it go. We all pay the sub, that's pulling our wait enough in my mind, I prefer more content thru continuous subs paying, then pushing players away because of toxicity in the community. If I ever have a problem group that badly, then i'll leave.

[MeiUshu]

Honestly my group of friends is not all that large and if they are doing something wrong or not pulling the weight I definitely make note of it and tell them how to improve. I also do not carry my friends. Its one of the reasons I don't do content sales, I refuse to give those who would lazy their way through to get stuff regardless how much they pay me. I wont bring someone into something if they refuse to learn content or work to improve. Teaching someone something and carrying them are very different mindsets.

BUT you still carry them, you dont kick them, call them names and such? yeah..is called carry

[Rytank]

Not trying to take a side just some food for thought, anyways have a great day n enjoy life wether it's a real one or virtual

[Maxipep]

I'm more interested in how you play at 110%, can you expand on that please ?

[pikster]

A system needs to be in place that penalizes poor play despite how damning it would be to some players. Agree if you want or not but I know their are many who have been in a group where that one or two players just aren't doing what is needed and then punished for it.

Lets ignore the run with friends arguement, as it stands your friends are always available. Times do not always match up. We have lives and dont always have the ability to play together.

Not gonna happen, I dont even need to rationalize why its not going to, but its not.

They wont even give us interesting gear effects as they are worried about players not being able to do certain content without it.

[Alistaire]

While I agree that extreme laziness can be a problem

I'm not even saying laziness. Melee aoe is easier to do effortwise than doing a proper single-target rotation, and it makes it so you need less effort by the sheer number of gcd's saved per pull that it's the "lazy" route that way too.

If anything it's stubbornness and/or ignorance. Work smarter, not harder, etc. Melee aoe is both the easiest to do and the best to do on trash pulls baring the rare 1 or 2-mob pull where a tank can't or won't keep going.

Not gonna happen, I dont even need to rationalize why its not going to, but its not.

They wont even give us interesting gear effects as they are worried about players not being able to do certain content without it.

It's already in place, it's called the vote kick system, and has been confirmed by Yoshi P himself that "playstyle differences" is a legit reason to kick.

[Jetstream_Fox]

Oh hey look it's the "I'm better than the random people I get matched with in DF" thread again.

Seriously, you'll never get people who play as you do, there is always going to be better or worse, that's how it goes. If you really think this game suffers from people being more on the bad side I invite some of you to play actual skill based games outside of this PvE faceroll mess. Try playing Overwatch and watching your entire team pick someone just because they look cool and not knowing how to play at all. Or try Halo 5 and go into Warzone and spend 5 minutes watching 5 out of 12 teammates you have drive around aimlessly and not get past the first stronghold.

The solution for this has been given in the form of The Mentor Hall and to play with your friends. SE can't really make people use X skill at a certain time over skill Y. And the reason why things go slower and the lack of knowledge between players at time is head pounding, there is a vast area of reasons as to why it might be happening.