I guess it's time

[Kallera]

Yes Velhart, we deal with jerks in duty finder. what you fail to mention is that the duty finder IS THE BASIS OF THE MAJORITY OF CONTENT PARTAKEN IN THIS GAME. Also, much of the community is split apart into smaller cliques, again encouraged by the content. because said content is faster, grindy, andin the case of the bleeding edge, less forgiving, this results in players making drama over even sucessful runs in lower content.

[Velhart]

Yes Velhart, we deal with jerks in duty finder. what you fail to mention is that the duty finder IS THE BASIS OF THE MAJORITY OF CONTENT PARTAKEN IN THIS GAME. Also, much of the community is split apart into smaller cliques, again encouraged by the content. because said content is faster and overall less ofrgiving, this results in players making drama over even sucessful runs.

I use the duty roulette every day. The amount of toxic players I get is extremely far between. Most of the time the most people say is "Hello" and "Good bye". No matter what MMO you play in however form it is played in, you are going to deal with toxic, misbehaving players. You cannot prevent that unless you decide to stay within your friend circle and never leave it. This particular thing is not a FFXIV problem, it is a problem with online games in general.

[Kallera]

I use the duty roulette every day. The amount of toxic players I get is extremely far between. Most of the time the most people say is "Hello" and "Good bye". No matter what MMO you play in however form it is played in, you are going to deal with toxic, misbehaving players. You cannot prevent that unless you decide to stay within your friend circle and never leave it. This particular thing is not a FFXIV problem, it is a problem with online games in general.

Yeah, and staying within the friend circle is what a lot of people do in this game. Kinda part of the forums' numbers as well. What it takes to influence someone to engage with the larger community isn't something that can be automated, and sadly, is affected by game system convienence.

[Dextro]

My word, did someone actually say FFXIV has a more toxic community than FFXI? Since when and how? Was I the only one who remembers the toxic levels of HNMLS's in that game?

HNM drama was always memorable, but very rare, so I don't think it's accurate to make it sound like it was the day-to-day norm, across every server at that.
For Dynamis, the two servers that I played on both had leaders communicate and basically create a rota for which group runs and when; everyone was really respectful and there was no drama or bad blood between any of the groups. Every group would lend each other currency for relic weapons and even form an alliance or sub in members for zone clears at times.

It really was one of the better communities I've seen in an MMO, where people were aware that reputation on your server goes a long way, and preserving it is in everyone's best interest.

On this game, however, nobody really cares how they behave, because chances are they'll never encounter or have to play with anyone they're matched with ever again.

This type of 'anonymity' is what breeds toxicity, as is shown in virtually any online platform - from the quick-matchmaking games such as FPS and MOBAs, all the way through to social media:
Notice the correlation between the level of personal accountability and the frequency of shit-posts from Facebook > Youtube > 4chan.

How often did you hear people on XI complaining about players in a PT or mission group?
Now compare that to the hundreds of threads made about people being bad in DF, early hunt pullers, 24-man rage quits, vote abandons, tanks refusing to play if the healer is dpsing, tanks refusing to play if the healer isn't dpsing, and everything in between.

So no, I don't think XI had anywhere near the amount of crying and 'toxic behaviour' that this game has.
I don't know why anyone would think otherwise, it's just a by-product of making a game so casual and easily-accessible that it's played by millions.

[Fumijj_Gah]

HNM drama was always memorable, but very rare, so I don't think it's accurate to make it sound like it was the day-to-day norm, across every server at that.
For Dynamis, the two servers that I played on both had leaders communicate and basically create a rota for which group runs and when; everyone was really respectful and there was no drama or bad blood between any of the groups. Every group would lend each other currency for relic weapons and even form an alliance or sub in members for zone clears at times.

It really was one of the better communities I've seen in an MMO, where people were aware that reputation on your server goes a long way, and preserving it is in everyone's best interest.

On this game, however, nobody really cares how they behave, because chances are they'll never encounter or have to play with anyone they're matched with ever again.

This type of 'anonymity' is what breeds toxicity, as is shown in virtually any online platform - from the quick-matchmaking games such as FPS and MOBAs, all the way through to social media:
Notice the correlation between the level of personal accountability and the frequency of shit-posts from Facebook > Youtube > 4chan.

How often did you hear people on XI complaining about players in a PT or mission group?
Now compare that to the hundreds of threads made about people being bad in DF, early hunt pullers, 24-man rage quits, vote abandons, tanks refusing to play if the healer is dpsing, tanks refusing to play if the healer isn't dpsing, and everything in between.

So no, I don't think XI had anywhere near the amount of crying and 'toxic behaviour' that this game has.
I don't know why anyone would think otherwise, it's just a by-product of making a game so casual and easily-accessible that it's played by millions.

This. And let's say the amount of casual players is way higher in XIV due the easy and accessible content we have; pretty sure 90% of those players will never get out from Kazham.

[Claymore65]

I don't know why anyone would think otherwise, it's just a by-product of making a game so casual and easily-accessible that it's played by millions.

There's another factor to consider as well: Overall playerbase size. Currently, FFXIV is far larger in terms of player count than FFXI ever was. It may currently be impossible to have the same sort of tight-knit community with the game as large as it is. It's much harder to keep track of the sheer number of players.

While I understand the downsides of the "Duty Finder" and other quick-matchmaking, don't forget the benefits. Players can conveniently run most content (i.e. anything other than EX trials and Savage Raids) without having to dedicate to a firm schedule or a group. It makes the game incredibly convenient for a huge amount of players. While I certainly understand the desire for a more tight-knit community, I rather enjoy the current level of time-saving measures in the game. It allows me (and plenty of other players) to get a lot more done in a short amount of time.

I'm in no way saying the system is perfect, but a lot of the players currently playing FFXIV probably wouldn't have the time to play a much slower-paced MMO like FFXI. It comes down largely to personal preference.

[Obysuca]

There's another factor to consider as well: Overall playerbase size. Currently, FFXIV is far larger in terms of player count than FFXI ever was.

By "far larger" I assume you mean only about 100k-200k larger >_> XI peaked at around 500k-600k ish, XIV's got about that, maybe 700k ish. Don't go off of the "4 million accounts" that SE's mentioned. Accounts =/= active subscribers. Let's also not forget, part of that 700k ish are rmt. Also, just to point out, did you notice that when you search all on XIV, it won't tell you how many are actually on, like XI did? Kind of makes you feel like SE doesn't want people to know how low it really is.

[FallenArisen0990]

This. And let's say the amount of casual players is way higher in XIV due the easy and accessible content we have; pretty sure 90% of those players will never get out from Kazham.

LOL the amount of parties that stood by the Kazham zone compared to both the Jungle zones. Image if they had to go do Genkais... especially Genkai 3. XD

[Azrael]

Also, just to point out, did you notice that when you search all on XIV, it won't tell you how many are actually on, like XI did? Kind of makes you feel like SE doesn't want people to know how low it really is.

Exactly, SE doesn't want to let us know how many people are playing this game, even though I managed to with some trick, here is what I did on my phoenix server a while back,supposed to be one of the most populated EU servers:
There is a search function that you can use, what I did was searching for 2-3 classes at once making sure the result would never hit the 200 players cap. You can test this on your server too, if you got some time, if you are curious to know how many players are online on your server.
So for example look for all warriors 1-30, then 31-59, then 60. Add the results up and write it down. Remember make sure you don't hit the 200 cap. if you hit the cap with 31-59, make a search for 31-50 and another one for 51-59.
Do this for all other classes. Don't forget the J D E F languages.
Can't remember the exact number, but my results was something like 1200-1300 players logged on at the same time. If you ask me this is a low number compared to the 3k+ I had on my ragnarok server back in the golden days of FFXI.

[Obysuca]

Can't remember the exact number, but my results was something like 1200-1300 players logged on at the same time. If you ask me this is a low number compared to the 3k+ I had on my ragnarok server back in the golden days of FFXI.

Exactly. For some reason people seem to think theres 7k+ per server. Not to mention that considering my data center has the "two biggest servers" on it, you can't possibly tell me that with how big its supposed to be, that not a single tank or healer are queuing up for half the roulettes. More evidence that XIV isn't doing as well as SE wants us to think, just look at FCs now compared to pre-2.3. Back then, a majority of FCs that I saw had 30-50 active members on at a time. Now? Most I've seen while just running around is about ~15 online and thats one of the previous bigger FCs, while a lot seem to hover around 1-5 online through most of the day.

XI actually still has 2? 3? servers that are still over 1.2kish online, though most seem to stick around 500-800.