I guess it's time

[Thayos]

If I had a dollar for everyone who has ever said, "FFXIV is going to die if blah blah blah doesn't change..."

Yes, the population always declines at the end of patch cycles, and it also declined toward the end of 2.x. But whenever the big patch hits, or the expansion hits, everyone comes back. And I bet a lot of those people don't even cancel their subs... they're just playing other games while waiting for the new content.

I've never seen any interview or data saying the game has fewer than 500k active subs, btw. And on Hyperion, I see no visual evidence that would lead me to think anything is in decline.

The game is going to be fine. It has its audience, and the development team is continuing to spice things up. We have years and years to look forward to.

[Braden]

snip

You never answered my question.... no answer? Maybe not many is the answer

So on taking content and ideas from XI wouldn't work based on your opinion. Ok. I don't think that they should copy and paste, but ideas are good enough.

Id like to hear why things like salvage, abjurations (gear drop+crafted item= new piece of gear), forced spawned nms, and a delayed gratification wouldn't work?

Creating content that doesn't use the duty finder is bad?

Battle combat that requires you to work together(skillchain type of interaction) is not a good idea?

Jobs and classes with depth and flexibility are outdated too?

gear variety is negative?

The only reason I think anyone argues against XI ideas, is because they like being handed everything.

[FallenArisen0990]

The big problem I see here is MMOs used to be MMORPGs. It seems like in this modern age, people want less RPG and more MMO. MMOs is a very fitting term for these games nowadays because the "New Gens" just don't want the RPG aspect. That's all fine for the other MMOs out there but Final Fantasy is by it's very foundation a RPG. The Dev Team chose to go with the "Modern Age" MMOs when redesigning FFXIV. They may as well rename the game because all the Team wants to do is fully remove the FF and just leave the XIV. Adding in stuff from past FF games is just smoke and mirrors they are using to try and make us believe this is a Final Fantasy game. They were able to convert a few to adopt this style but not the ones that hold FFXI dear within their hearts. Since they can't convert these "rebel" players, they are trying to weed us out completely.

This is really what it boils down to MMOs vs MMORPGs.

[Melorie]

They may as well rename the game because all the Team wants to do is fully remove the FF and just leave the XIV. Adding in stuff from past FF games is just smoke and mirrors they are using to try and make us believe this is a Final Fantasy game.

No. It doesn't really need to have a combat/progression type to be a Final Fantasy game. IF the FF aspect FOR YOU has to do with a certain type of progression, it's okay. But having a FF world, lore-wise and aesthetically-wise works as well. It simply doesn't fit in your vision. Dragon Age:Origins is very different from Dragon Age II and Dragon Age:Inquisition, in almost everything, specially the combat style. Even the narrative progression is different. But it's still a Dragon Age game, with a Dragon Age lore, and many of Dragon Age's aesthetics that have marked the series. You may prefer one or another, but your personal opinion on the matter does not change the fact that yes, they're Dragon Age games, like it or not. The same can be said of FFXIV. You can take certain traits of the franchise and decide that they are the main symbols of the franchise for you. Doesn't mean that the developers should have the same vision as yours. Or anyone else tbh.

So yeah, that vision can certainly kill the game for you and those who share your concept. Doesn't make it a true statement outside your personal view.

[RLofOBFL]

According to SE itself, FF11 had a daily log in of 200-300K people during its heyday, it might've spiked during expansions up to 600K.

From 3.2, FF14 had 650,000 Active account, & HAD 5+ million people who bought at least 1 month of sub. Now for lifetime clears 490,000 people have cleared 2.0, 450,000 have beaten 2.5, 420,000 have cleared 2.55.

415,000 have entered HW, 360,000 have cleared 3.0. 311,000 people have beaten 3.1 & 250,000 people have beaten 3.2.

As you can see the numbers are steadily declining. Intepret this however but seeing how 5 million people got it & only 600K stuck with it ...Maybe they'd do better if they changed some stuff.

[FallenArisen0990]

Dragon Age Games

Dragon Age II maybe different from I combat wise and "vision," it still followed the Lore and still was an *gasp* an RPG. It still had elements. It still had Jobs that were true to their core (Tho some classes were nerfed hard). It still had the same races, still had the same traits for these races. XIV doesn't follow suit with that at all. It changed DRK's Souleater because it didn't "Fit". Im tired of the Team changing things that are FF stapled because it doesn't "fit their vision". Fire I, II, III changed from Fire, Fira, Firaga over some dumb excuse (Yes I know this is a regional thing but I still find it stupid).

[Ryel]

Yes, the population always declines at the end of patch cycles, and it also declined toward the end of 2.x. But whenever the big patch hits, or the expansion hits, everyone comes back. And I bet a lot of those people don't even cancel their subs... they're just playing other games while waiting for the new content.

And yet for a subscription based MMO this should never actually be the case.

The entire point behind a subscription model is that you're paying not only for regular updates but also a steady stream of interesting activity (this is subjective), there are f2p and b2p games on the market that are currently matching the pace of play that XIV is currently providing and this shouldn't really be the case.

If a large numbers of players are consistently declining in activity for predictable periods every single patch i would say that's something that warrants investigation as our subs don't magically lower themselves to match this decline, yet features like housing require us to remain bound to the game no matter what the state of content currently is.

It's also been observed by many, that a large number of players who leave during these slow periods aren't actually coming back or if they are they're only doing so during the free login periods and not actually re-subbing, the irony is that you're posting in a thread where the OP is quite literally giving reasons as to why they're unsubscribing from the game with many agreeing with and following suit because of those reasons.

I've never seen any interview or data saying the game has fewer than 500k active subs, btw. And on Hyperion, I see no visual evidence that would lead me to think anything is in decline.

No company actually does this, in fact standard practice is to -not- release numbers when they start to decline. Someone actually did post the results of the unofficial census earlier in this thread that actually did illustrate a massive decline in subs around the period of 3.0-3.1

The game is going to be fine. It has its audience, and the development team is continuing to spice things up. We have years and years to look forward to.

There are many players from that audience also voicing concerns with the content as a whole, or are those complaints somehow worth less than others?

[KitingGenbu]

When people want to compare the success of XIV to XI, honestly its not a fair comparison since one game has something that the other did not have, which is a cash shop. In terms of subs, they honestly have the same amount but that varies on the time. At its peak, XI did not have much other competition other than wow and a handful of titles. Since this game has many of WoW's elements and Blizzard has been doing a very lack luster job at producing any content with about a year long content drought on their last two expansions, of course this game will get decent numbers over time, just like you'll see a big dip next month when Legion is released and probably wont be back up till 3.4. But going back to the cash shop, that's honestly the major reason as to why the game is one of SE's highest profit major, which is also something XI never really had. Best you could do at XI's prime time was server transfer and that was once every 3 months. This game you can buy clothing, dyes, name changes, appearance changes, etc each going from 5-15$ each, which I'm guilty of over indulging in myself. So XIV isn't better because of the actual game features but the time and excess expenses that people honestly want more of since they dont believe in working for glamour (I dont want glamour to be my end game either though tbh).

[Velhart]

You never answered my question.... no answer? Maybe not many is the answer

So on taking content and ideas from XI wouldn't work based on your opinion. Ok. I don't think that they should copy and paste, but ideas are good enough.

It is still hilarious that multiple times you have to be told I am not 100% against ideas from FFXI. But go ahead and keep showing off that wonderful reading comprehension of yours.

Id like to hear why things like salvage, abjurations (gear drop+crafted item= new piece of gear), forced spawned nms, and a delayed gratification wouldn't work?

If you actually read (ohh wait the reading comprehension thing, sorry), I said I am for content similar to Salvage, which is something I believe that Palace of the Dead is similar to. Delayed gratification. You know, the same people preach that people get bored easily and leave yet also preach that delayed gratification would be a working system for this game. I ask several times how delayed gratification is the solution to that? Why can't anyone give any proper answer or proof without saying "well it worked in FFXI" That is not proof.

Creating content that doesn't use the duty finder is bad?

Depends on what it is. Aquapolis does not use DF and works just fine.

Battle combat that requires you to work together(skillchain type of interaction) is not a good idea?

For this game in particular? Yes. The combat is not built for it, especially with how the game is set up to be very mechanic heavy fights.

Jobs and classes with depth and flexibility are outdated too?

This game's depth in the job system is quite there. It just doesn't go into a convoluted state where specific actions are required for specific fights. It offers depth while being accessible. This in turn allows for bosses with stronger mechanics. I rather have a fun boss fight with strong mechanics than staring at my bar picking what elemental spell to use. That isn't fun. Also don't try to convince me the system has no depth when people even to this day constantly find ways to improve one's DPS or switches in rotation. Not to mention, on MCH alone I constantly have to alter my base rotation to make sure I am performing the mechanics and maximizing my DPS at the same time. So don't lie to me and say this game's battle has no depth. It just isn't convoluted.

gear variety is negative?

We have it already, you have multiple ways of getting multiple gear from different content. Sorry if you don't like how they do it, but it is there. If they want to make a gear set that has a set bonus similar to how lower level Grand Company gear works, I am all for it as long as it is done right and does not cause an imbalance.

The only reason I think anyone argues against XI ideas, is because they like being handed everything.

Really? Because I really want that ilvl245 gun from Savage and SE hasn't come to hand it to me on a silver platter yet. What gives SE?

[Beetle]

According to SE itself, FF11 had a daily log in of 200-300K people during its heyday, it might've spiked during expansions up to 600K.

From 3.2, FF14 had 650,000 Active account, & HAD 5+ million people who bought at least 1 month of sub. Now for lifetime clears 490,000 people have cleared 2.0, 450,000 have beaten 2.5, 420,000 have cleared 2.55.

415,000 have entered HW, 360,000 have cleared 3.0. 311,000 people have beaten 3.1 & 250,000 people have beaten 3.2.

As you can see the numbers are steadily declining. Intepret this however but seeing how 5 million people got it & only 600K stuck with it ...Maybe they'd do better if they changed some stuff.

So we're losing 50-60k accounts each patch. Which means there might be 200k players left at the end of 3.3. It will probably spike back up by 30k-50k on the main patch then go back down. So 130-160k accounts at the end of 3.5?