I guess it's time

[Cakekizyy]

Exactly, SE doesn't want to let us know how many people are playing this game, even though I managed to with some trick, her all
Can't remember the exact number, but my results was something like 1200-1300 players logged on at the same time. If you ask me this is a low number compared to the 3k+ I had on my ragnarok server back in the golden days of FFXI.

Doesn't busy prevent being found by search?

[Azrael]

Doesn't busy prevent being found by search?

No, it doesn't.

[Fumijj_Gah]

We have for sure less players per server compared to FFXI's golden time while we do have more servers here, though.
Problem is overall quality dropped really hard as soon as they replaced the FFXI's team; everything is for casual players now and the hardcore contents disappeared (and no 4 bosses every 5 months doesn't change anything, plus not talking about raids only).
Yoshi-P lacks of the right mindset, unfortunately.

[Velhart]

We have for sure less players per server compared to FFXI's golden time while we do have more servers here, though.
Problem is overall quality dropped really hard as soon as they replaced the FFXI's team; everything is for casual players now and the hardcore contents disappeared (and no 4 bosses every 5 months doesn't change anything, plus not talking about raids only).
Yoshi-P lacks of the right mindset, unfortunately.

What dictates hardcore to you? Is it how long it takes to get an item? Or is it the actually level of difficulty in the content?

[Fumijj_Gah]

What dictates hardcore to you? Is it how long it takes to get an item? Or is it the actually level of difficulty in the content?

Both, long and hard contents were all around on XI back in time. With honest rewards people gonna be -proud- for years, see the Armada Hauberk set for DPS or even the relic itself.
FFXIV is just a loop of a really boring pattern where rewards gonna get deprecated in few weeks/months.
Like I've wrote before in this thread, relic quest should be like this;

a) Killing the highest raid tier multiple times (x10).
b) Getting the drop (?? item) from the same turn with a very low drop rate.
c) Getting another drop (?? item) from a secondary end game content with the same difficulty level (highest tier) such dynamis.
d) Including high amount of gils in the process.
e) Pushing the exploration, open world contents; collecting items around the world in extremely dangerous areas (raid team required to get through them).
f) Getting highest tier crafters together (those few around if we had a decent crafting system) in order to craft the item itself and to pull overmelds.


And yeah, your signature explains straight away how sick is FFXIV at the moment, with the director focusing on 'fun' and not 'dedication', 'skill' and 'rewards' which are the true essence of MMORPGs.
He even fails on the 'fun' point cause the game is super boring at the moment. If for 'fun' he means dancing emotes and few casual contents which are going to get old after few hours, then yeah, he -really- does it wrong.

[ThirdChild_ZKI]

As much as I'm openly not a fan of the relic, both old and new, what you proposed completely loses me at A (I don't mind raiding, but I already dislike the arbitrary 10 runs bit), B (Atma again), D (no. Flatly, NO.), and E (Nothing against crafters, but just like D, if you're not rich, or a crafter, you're out in the cold on this one).

I don't mind a reasonable, REASONABLE grind, and I actually prefer the chllenging road, but much of what you said is like taking the worst of the relic, and combining it with the worst of its alternatives. I respect your opinion and ideas, but no thanks.

In fairness, whether I complete this relic or not (never finished the 50 one), I'm done with relics for good if they maintain this approach.

[Velhart]

snip

Interesting. So how does this work on a casual level? So far this seems more catered to hardcore players. Note this is a game where they specifically mention they care about balancing casual, midcore, and hardcore content. Their execution of this philosophy is certainly questionable, but how does your approach remedy this? FFXIV certainly has it's issues in how to properly balance content and I have made several long posts on that alone, but I only see people that give ideas that cater only to a specific crowd instead of how it works to balance the philosophy they try to execute properly.

I think the "true essence" of MMORPG's is subjective. Gear to myself at least is only a means to accomplish the content in front of me. Something like beating AS8 in this game is way more satisfying than what is dangling on the stick at the end. Its a plus, but I would figure that mindset is more secondary. That is just myself however. FFXI was very gated on it's gear and content, and worked for what it was, but does this system truly appeal on a mass level? I like to see ideas that keep things balance, not cater to a niche group.

[Fumijj_Gah]

I don't mind a reasonable, REASONABLE

That's the point; the highest-tier weapons in game should be crazy to get, not for everyone. Those are the weapons only few players per server should get, like relics in XI and legendaries on World of Warcraft.
Plus hardcore raid gear should be 20+ item level above the casual one (tomestone or whatever). Like I said before, 'dedication', 'skill' and 'rewards': that's where the game is very sick now and poor of contents.

[Fumijj_Gah]

Interesting. So how does this work on a casual level? So far this seems more catered to hardcore players.

Eh, that's why the game is really bad for hardcore players at the moment. And for hardcore players I don't mean those who can clear the savage raids only, but people who put a true effort in order to obtain the highest rewards. Crafting system is a joke, for example. It has so much potential due the 1.0 origin/ideas but that's all. Balancing casual, midcore and hardcore contents is not a thing, it doesn't work, you need contents for all the players and their playstyle; in this way if you want a silly example, hardcore players gonna blame cause they'll say the relic is a weapon for plebs and on the other hand the casual players gonna say the relic grind is hot.

We really should get gear sets accessible only for hardcore players/those who want to put a huge effort in the game together with other people on the same page (no solo contents).
That's when you give the right pleasure to all the players. Balancing contents is an excuse, they need to do ways more, specified contents for players.

[Erudito]

I fear it may soon be time for me as well. I have been in the game for a very long time. Not as long as 1.0 or beta or whatever but about 2 years I think.

Anyway, everything in the game feels like a job or a chore now. I do roulette, dailies, weeklies, craft, gather, manage my FCs airships, a relic and even have set long term goals. However, these days I have to think it over 2 or 3 times before I do anything because there is this grating "I don't want to do this anymore" feeling at the back of my head. Its not an "I am tired" feeling, its more of a "I really and truly hate this now, and never want to do it again" type of feeling.

I would even go as far as say that the methods the developers use to keep us here are now taking an opposite effect with me. This is even more apparent to me for gathering and crafting.
The time of the nodes and scripts are horrendous while favors timer scares me away.
For crafting, well, if I have none of the items for an item level 52 and above and don't use Market due to insane costs, it takes over twenty minutes to get all the materials and craft that one item, enough said.

I don't know. The concept of dailies and weeklies prevents me from outright taking a break.

Well, just my predicament.