"Coming into its own" is too much!

[Kallera]

What do you want to do instead?
Everything beside levelling, crafting/gathering and being afk in idleshire is actually working towards the relic, since everything gives you eso/poes.

Relic is for those who do at least 20-60h of current and outdated content per relic step (i.e. actually playing the game for 1-2h a day).

you can bold, underline and italicize the 40 to 60h, but not only is that taking up the lion's share of that time per day, whether it is fun for the player is also up in the air, since those were the same dungeons grinded for tomestone gear. The point I was making is that 40-60 hours of playtime is going to be a lot less appealing and more of a wall when it is something that is no longer fun to the player.

[Neophyte]

you can bold, underline and italicize the 40 to 60h, but not only is that taking up the lion's share of that time per day, whether it is fun for the player is also up in the air, since those were the same dungeons grinded for tomestone gear. The point I was making is that 40-60 hours of playtime is going to be a lot less appealing and more of a wall when it is something that is no longer fun to the player.

If this is not fun for the player, then playing current and outdated content is not fun for that player. Ergo he should stop playing something which is no fun to him.

There are only three options, if 'playing' 40h a month:
A) you do current/old content and cap all tombstones
B) you do current/old content and buy relic/gear
C) you do not much content at all

[Kallera]

When this is not fun for the player, playing actual current and outsated content is not fun for that player. Ergo he should stop playing something which is no fun to him.

You insisted the steps were not much, I gave you a reason why they would be, from the perspective of someone that did see 210 as too much when they were released. The 210 step seemed quite insurmountable when I first saw it, and it is only long after I got my 230 weapon that I got past it. As casual content, it failed to inspire me to run df for days on end, and as a weapon, was only usable recently, with yet another step that isn't having me run for the df, because its a lot of the same runs I already did.

[Neophyte]

But 90% of a patch cycle insist of doing 'the same runs I did before'. You get 10h doing something new per patch, the other 100h+ is just repeating content.
Either that or stopping until next patch.

If you get your relic in 10h, what would change regarding the time you spent in the game having fun?

You have your relic, but still 2-3 months until new content. And now?

[Kallera]

But 90% of a patch cycle insist of doing 'the same runs I did before'. Either that or stopping until next patch.

If you get your relic in 10h, what would change regarding the time you spent in the game having fun?

You have your relic, but still 2-3 months until new content. And now?

This is a problem with the games' content, but assuming it wasn't, I would be doing things I want to do and playing the game without being the feeling of being harried by a timer or the fear of wasting my efforts. My experience would be more "I want to do this." instead of "I have to do this.".

Which is kinda what I do now thing that I want to do. And why I don't care much for the defense of the relic.

[Neophyte]

This is a problem with the games' content, but assuming it wasn't, I would be doing things I want to do and playing the game without being the feeling of being harried by a timer or the fear of wasting my efforts. My experience would be more "I want to do this." instead of "I have to do this.".

Which is kinda what I do now thing that I want to do. And why I don't care much for the defense of the relic.

This is no problem with the games content, it's the nature of content. You can do something for the first time only once. And even randomizing dungeons and such stuff won't help much.
Every game which gets a dlc or other new content:
Either do the new stuff and repeat it or do the new stuff and stop.

Relic is the reward for staying a specific time after you've seen everything new.

[Kallera]

This is no problem with the games content, it's the nature of content. You can do something for the first time only once. And even randomizing dungeons and such stuff won't help much.
Every game which gets a dlc or other new content:
Either do the new stuff and repeat it or do the new stuff and stop.

Relic is the reward for staying a specific time after you've seen everything new.

I feel there is something wrong with it, because I found it a shallow reward that, brings out things I find to be unenjoyable about endgame.

But my distaste for the relic are off track from this thread. this was about how someone may feel 40-60 hours of work may be seen as too much time to devote to the relic quest.

[Ryaz]

But 90% of a patch cycle insist of doing 'the same runs I did before'. You get 10h doing something new per patch, the other 100h+ is just repeating content.
Either that or stopping until next patch.

If you get your relic in 10h, what would change regarding the time you spent in the game having fun?

You have your relic, but still 2-3 months until new content. And now?

If anything leads to FFXIV'S downfall, it'll be this. Unless something changes drastically in the next expansion, it will most likely be my last one. When the only thing that game has is a grind, there's something wrong with the game. It's an MMO problem in general, honestly, and why so many MMOS have trouble keeping players. WoW got so many players because it was really the only option, but now they're losing players like crazy and I wouldn't be surprised if this game followed suit.

Heavensward had a good story but beyond that everything felt stale pretty quickly because it was more of same. Even the new jobs didn't really feel that unique.